Photon propagation? Is this correct?

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    Photon Propagation
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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the representation of photon propagation in a drawn model, questioning whether the depicted black line accurately represents this propagation. Participants explore the nature of photons, their behavior, and the implications of different models in the context of electromagnetic waves and quantum mechanics.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Debate/contested
  • Conceptual clarification

Main Points Raised

  • Some participants question whether the black line represents photon propagation, suggesting that a photon does not follow a defined path like a bullet.
  • There is a discussion about the necessity of including all behaviors of photons in any useful model, with references to the two-slit experiment demonstrating the wave-like behavior of photons.
  • Participants note that the "wiggly lines" in the model represent electric and magnetic fields, indicating that a simple bullet-like model is insufficient for describing photon behavior.
  • One participant emphasizes that the quantization of electromagnetic radiation means energy changes occur in discrete amounts (photons), which complicates the notion of a light beam as a stream of particles.
  • Concerns are raised about the clarity of the drawn model, with calls for better descriptions to avoid misinterpretation.
  • Some participants argue that existing diagrams do not accurately describe photons but rather illustrate the behavior of electromagnetic fields in wave propagation.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express disagreement regarding the adequacy of the drawn model to represent photon propagation. There is no consensus on how to accurately depict or understand the behavior of photons, with multiple competing views on the nature of light and its representation.

Contextual Notes

The discussion highlights limitations in the drawn model and the assumptions underlying different interpretations of photon behavior. Participants point out the need for clearer definitions and descriptions to facilitate understanding.

revv
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Ok so I drew up something (I know its horrible), but is this correct?

Does the black line in the middle represent the propagation of the photon?

If this is correct I would like to know and anything else that could help me or just anything related to this.

63twX4m.png
 

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revv said:
Does the black line in the middle represent the propagation of the photon?
This model just doesn't work. A photon is not like a little bullet and any useful model of it has to include all of its behaviour.
The photon occupies all of space between being produced and absorbed. It doesn't behave as if following a 'path'. If you look at the two slits experiment (the simplest you can consider, there is a 'contribution' of the photon's energy that goes through both slits. That is demonstrated by the fact that both slits are needed for the interference pattern to form.
The 'wiggly line' that you drew describes a different aspect of EM energy.
 
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sophiecentaur said:
This model just doesn't work. A photon is not like a little bullet and any useful model of it has to include all of its behaviour.

By behaviors do you mean a particle or wave?

And the "wiggly lines" are electric and magnetic (fields?)
 
The wiggly lines do represent the electric and magnetic fields. I think what sophiecentaur is trying to say is that a simple model just displaying the photon as a bullet doesn't usually give an accurate model of a photon since photos behave quite diffirently a lot of the time.
 
revv said:
Does the black line in the middle represent the propagation of the photon?
One should never think of a light beam as stream of traveling particles across space. Quantization of electromagnetic radiation means that the field energy can only be changed by integer numbers of „energy portions“ (called photons) of amount hν, where ν is light frequency and h Planck's constant.
 
revv said:
And the "wiggly lines" are electric and magnetic (fields?)

You drew them. You tell us.:wink:

Seriously, a vague sketch with no description behind it forces us to guess when you mean.
 
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The diagrams that have been quoted are not descriptions of a photon, remember. They just describe the variation with time and distance of the Fields in the direction of propagation of a plane wave. There are no wiggly photons or bullets involved in either of them.
I have to blame the people who 'know' advanced Physics and who write educational books and articles about photons and who assume that people receive the right message when the word "particle" is used.
 
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