Primary magnetizing impedance of non-ideal transformer

In summary: However, when the secondary is closed, the magnetizing resistance and inductance are the only two components that contribute to current. So, I was wondering if I could get the magnetizing inductance and resistance from measured V I data.
  • #1
Vikas Kasireddy
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I am trying to determine the primary magnetizing inductance + core shunt resistance of a transformer. I attached the equivalent circuit of the transformer. I left the secondary open and have an AC voltage on the primary. This causes the coupling leakage inductance and coil resistance to appear as zero. How to I get the magnetizing inductance and resistance from measured V, I (sense resistor 10ohm )data.
 

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  • #2
Vikas Kasireddy said:
I am trying to determine the primary magnetizing inductance + core shunt resistance of a transformer. I attached the equivalent circuit of the transformer. I left the secondary open and have an AC voltage on the primary. This causes the coupling leakage inductance and coil resistance to appear as zero. How to I get the magnetizing inductance and resistance from measured V, I (sense resistor 10ohm )data.
Welcome to the PF.

That model circuit looks wrong to me. Can you link to where you saw it? If the secondary winding is open, you will mainly see the input leakage inductance Lk in series with the magnetizing inductance Lm, and the primary loss terms will interact as well...
 
  • #4
Vikas Kasireddy said:
http://nptel.ac.in/courses/Webcourse-contents/IIT-KANPUR/power-system/chapter_1/1_18.html

Correct me if I am wrong, but I thought when the secondary is open, no current passes through the primary of the ideal transformer part. The only current we see is due to the magnetizing resistance and inductance.
Sorry, are you asking about an ideal transformer or a real transformer? I thought you were asking about a real transformer.
 
  • #5
Vikas Kasireddy said:
magnetizing resistance
And I don't know what you mean by that term...
 
  • #7
Yes, my question is about a real transformer. Equivalent circuit of a real transformer has the following components,
Rcore and Lprim for magnetizing impedance
R coil resistance and leakage inductance due to windings
Ideal transformer.
I know when the secondary is open, no current passes through the primary winding of the ideal transformer in the equivalence circuit diagram. Hence no current passes through Rs and Ls. The only current is through the primary magnetizing impedance Rcore and Lprim. I have data for V and I across primary winding. All I need to understand is how to calculate inductance and resistance from V I data
 
  • #8
berkeman said:
This would be more like the model I'' used to using in SPICE (although it may reduce to what you are asking about)...

https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/3/39/TREQCCT.jpg
TREQCCT.jpg

I was told that Rp and Xp can be shifted to after Rc and Xm terms since the current Io is very much less than Is. This is where the equivalent circuit I suggested comes from.
 
  • #9
Vikas Kasireddy said:
since the current Io is very much less than Is

Not true when ##I_s=0##
 
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  • #10
Vikas Kasireddy said:
I was told that Rp and Xp can be shifted to after Rc and Xm terms since the current Io is very much less than Is
As anorlunda said, this is not true when Is=0. You should keep the primary impedance "before" the magnetizing branch. But when the secondary is open, values of Xm and Rc are very much greater than R1 and X1, hence, the drop across primary impedance is neglected.
Vikas Kasireddy said:
The only current we see is due to the magnetizing resistance and inductance.
What you are calling as megnatizing resistance actually represents core losses.
Connect a wattmeter in the primary and measure the no-load power W consumed at rated primary voltage. The power recorded W by the wattmeter is the core loss at rated voltage.
Zo=Vo/Io
cosΦo=W/VoIo.
Xm=ZosinΦo and
Ro=ZocosΦo.
 
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  • #11
Thanks guys! I did consider the primary windings inductance and resistance for open secondary and it makes sense.
 

1. What is primary magnetizing impedance of a non-ideal transformer?

The primary magnetizing impedance of a non-ideal transformer is a measure of the resistance and reactance that the primary winding presents to the flow of magnetizing current. It is affected by factors such as core losses and leakage inductance.

2. How is primary magnetizing impedance calculated?

The primary magnetizing impedance can be calculated by dividing the voltage drop across the primary winding by the magnetizing current. It can also be determined by measuring the open-circuit voltage and short-circuit current of the transformer.

3. What is the significance of primary magnetizing impedance in transformer design?

The primary magnetizing impedance is an important factor in transformer design as it can affect the efficiency, voltage regulation, and overall performance of the transformer. It is used to determine the appropriate size and number of turns for the primary winding.

4. How does primary magnetizing impedance differ in ideal and non-ideal transformers?

In an ideal transformer, the primary magnetizing impedance is purely resistive and is equal to the primary winding resistance. In a non-ideal transformer, the primary magnetizing impedance also includes reactive components due to factors such as core losses and leakage inductance.

5. Can the primary magnetizing impedance of a non-ideal transformer be reduced?

Yes, the primary magnetizing impedance of a non-ideal transformer can be reduced by minimizing core losses and leakage inductance. This can be achieved through proper transformer design and construction, such as using high-quality materials and optimizing the winding arrangement.

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