Propagation velocity of transverse wave on a bar

Click For Summary

Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the propagation velocity of transverse waves in a long thin bar or rod, focusing on the relationship between this velocity and material properties such as Young's modulus (E) and density, as well as geometric factors like the second moment of area (I). Participants explore the complexities of deriving an expression for this velocity and its dependence on the rod's profile shape.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Technical explanation
  • Debate/contested

Main Points Raised

  • One participant seeks an expression for the propagation velocity of transverse waves in a rod, mentioning familiarity with related concepts but difficulty in deriving the expression.
  • Another participant provides the elastic equation for shear waves, indicating that the propagation velocity is defined by the shear modulus and density, independent of the object's shape.
  • A subsequent reply questions the applicability of the isotropic equation to a long thin rod, suggesting that the transverse wave velocity may depend on the second moment of area (I) and the rod's profile shape, as evidenced by differing modal frequencies in beams of the same mass but different geometries.
  • Further clarification is provided that while the velocity equation is a material property, the oscillatory modes of rods and beams are influenced by their shape, indicating a distinction between wave propagation and vibrational modes.
  • One participant expresses a need to control propagation time in a hollow aluminum rod by selecting material and radial geometry, emphasizing the role of stiffness and its relation to the second moment of area.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants do not reach a consensus on the applicability of the isotropic equation for transverse wave propagation in rods with varying geometries. There is recognition of the complexity involved in relating wave velocity to both material properties and geometric factors, with differing viewpoints on how these factors interact.

Contextual Notes

The discussion highlights limitations in the current understanding of how to incorporate geometric variations into the propagation velocity equation, particularly regarding the second moment of area and its influence on stiffness and compliance.

luckydog
Messages
3
Reaction score
0
I need to know the propagation velocity of a transverse wave on a long thin bar or rod. In terms of material properties, such as E and density, and in terms of geometry such as I (2nd moment of area).

I'm a physics grad, so reasonably versed in such things. But can neither find nor derive an expression. So help appreciated.

Either an expression for propagation velocity, or some help in finding an expression for compliance per unit length, from which I can probably derive it.

Thx.

LD
 
Physics news on Phys.org
The elastic equation for a shear (transverse) wave in a solid medium is

[tex]\frac{1}{{{\beta ^2}}}\frac{{{\partial ^2}{\theta _x}}}{{\partial {t^2}}} = {\nabla ^2}{\theta _x}[/tex]

where

[tex]\beta = \frac{\mu }{\rho }[/tex]

and

[tex]{\theta _x}[/tex] is the one dimensional displacement

[tex]\mu[/tex] is the shear modulus = modulus of rigidity

[tex]\rho[/tex] is the density

t is, of course, time

This is independent of the shape of the object.

Hope this helps
 
Thanks studiot. Appreciated.

However, the application of that isotropic equation doesn't seem to fit well. In the case of a long thin rod, from published solutions for beam modal self resonance, transverse wave velocity appears to be dependent upon profile shape, ie second moment of area I. For example, two beams of equivalent mass/length but differing in I (say one is hollow but with larger radius), have different transverse modal self resonant fs for the same length. Therefore differ in propagation velocity. Presumably the compliance/length differs with I, and therefore profile ?

I was hoping for a solution that readily embraces differing area profiles. Presumably the isotropic equation can be adapted or applied, but I can't see how.
 
I'm not sure what you are looking for.

The velocity I offered is a material property. It is for the propagation of waves through the medium.

There are oscillatory modes available to rods, beams and other structural elements, by virtue of their shape, but this is a different thing. This is about vibration of the element as a whole.

The equation I posted is also a simple approximation. Depending upon your application there are effects noted which depend upon the application. For example concrete piles are long thin rods and commonly tested by shear wave pulses. There is some reference to this NDT method on the web.
 
Hi Studiot. Yes, thanks for posting the equation, it's correct and I understand it for isotropic solids. But the application I have requires to know the transverse pulse response propagation time in a long thin aluminium rod, with a circular cross section that could be hollow with a relatively thin wall. I wish to control the propagation time for a fixed length, by selecting material and radial geometry such as outer and inner radius.

The reason I mention vibration modal frequencies of beams is that i believe it illustrates how propagation velocity of a rod is also a function of radial profile (for a constant mass/length) as well as a function of material properties. Presumably, stiffness/length varies with I...

However the isotropic solid propagation equation seems not to readily accommodate variation due to various I values associated with different radial profiles. Or I can't see how to apply it so that it does.
 
Last edited:

Similar threads

  • · Replies 9 ·
Replies
9
Views
2K
  • · Replies 1 ·
Replies
1
Views
2K
  • · Replies 13 ·
Replies
13
Views
3K
  • · Replies 1 ·
Replies
1
Views
4K
  • · Replies 3 ·
Replies
3
Views
3K
  • · Replies 4 ·
Replies
4
Views
2K
  • · Replies 4 ·
Replies
4
Views
3K
  • · Replies 10 ·
Replies
10
Views
5K
  • · Replies 3 ·
Replies
3
Views
5K
  • · Replies 2 ·
Replies
2
Views
4K