Proving the triple curl identity

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Homework Help Overview

The problem involves proving the triple curl identity in vector calculus, specifically using Einstein notation. The original poster presents an equation involving the curl of a curl of a vector field and attempts to manipulate it to show equivalence to another expression involving divergence and second derivatives.

Discussion Character

  • Mathematical reasoning, Assumption checking

Approaches and Questions Raised

  • The original poster attempts to derive the identity step by step but expresses uncertainty about the validity of pulling constants out of derivatives and switching differential operators. They seek hints rather than complete solutions.
  • Some participants suggest writing the right-hand side of the original equation in component form and question the notation used for partial derivatives.
  • Others raise concerns about the treatment of dummy indices and the consistency of notation throughout the derivation.

Discussion Status

Contextual Notes

Participants note typographical errors and the potential for confusion arising from the notation used for partial derivatives. There is also mention of the original poster's request for guidance without revealing complete solutions, reflecting the forum's learning-first approach.

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Homework Statement



Prove that \nabla \times (\nabla \times \vec{A}) = \nabla(\nabla \cdot \vec{A}) - (\nabla \cdot \nabla)\vec{A} using Einstein notation.

Homework Equations



\nabla \times (\nabla \times \vec{A}) = \nabla(\nabla \cdot \vec{A}) - (\nabla \cdot \nabla)\vec{A}

\varepsilon_{ijk}\varepsilon_{imn} = \delta_{jm}\delta_{kn} - \delta_{jn}\delta_{km}

The Attempt at a Solution



\begin{equation*}<br /> \begin{split}<br /> \nabla \times (\nabla \times \vec{A})&amp; = \nabla \times (\varepsilon_{ijk}\frac{\partial A_k}{\partial_j})_i\\<br /> &amp; = [\varepsilon_{lmn} \frac{\partial}{\partial_m}(\varepsilon_{njk}\frac{\partial A_k}{\partial_j})_n]_l\\<br /> &amp; = [-\varepsilon_{nml}\varepsilon_{njk} \frac{\partial}{\partial_m}(\frac{\partial A_k}{\partial_j})_n]_l\\\<br /> &amp; =[(\delta_{mk}\delta_{lj} - \delta_{jm}\delta_{lk})\frac{\partial}{\partial_m}(\varepsilon_{ijk}\frac{\partial A_k}{\partial_j})_n]_l\\<br /> &amp; = [\frac{\partial}{\partial_k}(\frac{\partial A_k}{\partial_j})_n - \frac{\partial}{\partial_m}(\frac{\partial A_k}{\partial_m})_n]_l<br /> \end{split}<br /> \end{equation}<br />

One step that I'm not sure about was pulling \epsilon_{njk} out in step 3. Although it's a constant, it seems like it would depend on n, so I don't know if I'm allowed to do that. If everything is right up to the last step, then I'm confused about what to do next. What I have in the last line definitely doesn't look close to the answer.

Thanks in advance for any help with this problem. If you could just provide hints as to the next step or errors in my logic rather than giving away the solution, that would be great. I usually don't like asking for help, but I'm in a difficult situation at the moment.

Thanks!
 
Last edited:
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Hmm.. I made a few typographical errors, but it seems my editing hasn't changed anything. Maybe it takes a while to update.
 
Your notation \partial/\partial j is confusing. I would suggest either \partial/\partial x_j or \partial_j.

Anyway, you're very close. Just try writing out the RHS of the original equation in component form.
 
I wonder if I'm allowed to switch the differential operators in the first term of the last line. And then, since the second term is a constant, maybe I can pull it out of the vector. Doing that,

\begin{equation*}<br /> \begin{split}<br /> \nabla \times (\nabla \times \vec{A})&amp; = \nabla \times (\varepsilon_{ijk}\frac{\partial A_k}{\partial_j})_i\\<br /> &amp; = [\varepsilon_{lmn} \frac{\partial}{\partial_m}(\varepsilon_{njk}\frac{\partial A_k}{\partial_j})_n]_l\\<br /> &amp; = [-\varepsilon_{nml}\varepsilon_{njk} \frac{\partial}{\partial_m}(\frac{\partial A_k}{\partial_j})_n]_l\\\<br /> &amp; =[(\delta_{mk}\delta_{lj} - \delta_{jm}\delta_{lk})\frac{\partial}{\partial_m}(\varepsilon_{ijk}\frac{\partial A_k}{\partial_j})_n]_l\\<br /> &amp; = [\frac{\partial}{\partial_k}(\frac{\partial A_k}{\partial_j})_n - \frac{\partial}{\partial_m}(\frac{\partial A_k}{\partial_m})_n]_l\\<br /> &amp; = [\frac{\partial}{\partial_j}(\frac{\partial A_k}{\partial_k})_n]_l - \frac{\partial^2 A_k}{\partial^2_m}<br /> \end{split}<br /> \end{equation}<br />

Now it looks closer to the answer, I think. The only problem is that the first derivative of the first term should have the same index as the the component of the vector, i.e. n should be j. And it seems like the second term isn't a constant since it also has that subscript n. Hence my confusion.
 
You are using the partial derivative notation a bit funny. I would write your final expression as
\partial_j \partial_k A_k-\partial_m \partial_m A_k. And that's sort of what you want. I've dropped the funny 'component' subscripts, you don't need them, e.g.
(\varepsilon_{ijk} \partial_j A_k) is the ith component of a vector. I can tell that because j and k both occur twice, which makes them 'dummy' indices. Which is what's wrong with your final expression. In one term k is a dummy variable, in the other it's not. Can you figure out how that happened? Keep track of what is 'dummy' in any given step and make sure it stays that way.
 
Last edited:

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