Random Thoughts Part 4 - Split Thread

[zoobyshoe]

I see our differences here now. I haven't been talking about behaving in an inappropriate manner. Of course not. I meant the way people talk to each other or telling jokes, which are not pc. Sometimes we have similar discussions here on events where people crossed the lines of decency. I simply think in the US it's far more often and also turns into trials more often. My quote of what David said was after he told a joke that wasn't pc. (I don't remember the joke, and there were only two guys listening.) Not every bawdiness is worth talking about. And women can and do as well.

I think private political incorrectness is alive and well in the U.S. Whether it's worse in England would be hard to pin down. I'm not sure how you could measure it because people would hide it at the hint of suspicion, and anything like a questionnaire would be useless. I think it would be possible to compare the ratio of public actions against politically incorrect behaviors, though, like sanctions, censures, firings and trials. Those statistics are surely available if someone wanted to dig for them.

 

[WWGD]

I think private political incorrectness is alive and well in the U.S. Whether it's worse in England would be hard to pin down. I'm not sure how you could measure it because people would hide it at the hint of suspicion, and anything like a questionnaire would be useless. I think it would be possible to compare the ratio of public actions against politically incorrect behaviors, though, like sanctions, censures, firings and trials. Those statistics are surely available if someone wanted to dig for them.

Remember what happened to Bill Maher back in 2001 when he made some comments on 9/11? He was ostracized. He had a show called " Politically Incorrect". It ws quickly taken off the air by popular request after the comments he made. That was a while back, but I don't know of any similar show of a similar sort on basic cable TV today.

 

[zoobyshoe]

Remember what happened to Bill Maher back in 2001 when he made some comments on 9/11? He was ostracized. He had a show called " Politically Incorrect". It ws quickly taken off the air by popular request after the comments he made. That was a while back, but I don't know of any similar show of a similar sort on basic cable TV today.

 

[zoobyshoe]

Speaking of cowardly: when I went down to Starbucks today, there was a guy sitting drinking coffee and looking at his laptop who was covered with masses of little bumps. I had to resist the urge to walk out fast, telling myself, "It CAN'T be smallpox! He'd be writhing in agony if it was."

 

[WWGD]

Still, to be fair, there is a right place and a right way of saying things , which can be done without sacrificing truthfulness. True that there is a thin line between beeing sensitive and PC, but those that are adept ( I don't necessarily include myself here ) can walk that line without resorting to PC. An example, I guess, is that of a doctor telling a patient they are dying.

 

[zoobyshoe]

Still, to be fair, there is a right place and a right way of saying things , which can be done without sacrificing truthfulness. True that there is a thin line between beeing sensitive and PC, but those that are adept ( I don't necessarily include myself here ) can walk that line without resorting to PC. An example, I guess, is that of a doctor telling a patient they are dying.

If you're saying Bill was less being politically incorrect than he was just plain insensitive, then yes.

 

[zoobyshoe]

What is the politically correct way of telling someone they are dying? "Mr. Smith, I need to discuss the fact our recent round of tests indicate you may have some longevity challenges facing you."

 

[Ibix]

Responsibility does not have to be an either/or: if the school wants to allow weak, vulnerable students to attend classes then it should make an effort to make sure they are protected and consider beforehand the impact of exposing them to someone like Lewin. It is a shared responsibility in my view.

MIT gave him a platform, as they give a platform to many academics. Lewin's actions with that platform were his own (or, at least, I've seen no evidence to the contrary). MIT own the responsibility to check that their staff aren't abusing their position and to take action when they do (which they seem to have done, although possibly later than they should have). The staff have to own the responsibility not to abuse their platform.

Abuse of trust is the core of it, I think. Lewin abused MIT's trust that he would be a respectful teacher and he abused the students' trust that he would be a respectful teacher. Certainly MIT have a resposibility to their students to police the trust they put in their professors to some extent, but the ultimate responsibility for not abusing trust can only belong to the person being trusted.

I feel this has gone on long enough for the random thoughts thread, so I'm drawing a line for myself under the topic here.

 

[dkotschessaa]

Thinking about it, I can't remember ever having dropped a piece of toast on the floor in my life.

That's highly improbable, so, congrats!

 

[HomogenousCow]

and he abused the students' trust that he would be a respectful teacher.

Again I feel like you're implying something unreasonable here. People are making it sound like he raped a student or something, when in fact it was completely consensual. (We haven't read any evidence of the contrary)

 

[Ibix]

Again I feel like you're implying something unreasonable here. People are making it sound like he raped a student or something, when in fact it was completely consensual. (We haven't read any evidence of the contrary)

Did anyone except me actually read the IHE article you linked? I keep citing it in support of my position, and I'm not seeing any counter-citations. Anyway, it's titled "We all felt trapped" and says that Harbi "was pushed to participate". Neither of those sounds particularly consensual to me.

Authority figures and experts (people in positions of power, however limited) need to be careful how they make requests because, unless they take pains to clearly communicate otherwise, the recipient of the request is likely to hear "...or I'll withdraw my support". The most sympathetic reading I can make of the situation is that Lewin made requests without realising the implied threat. The problem is, even if he didn't realize it, someone else did - and wrote MIT policies against staff-student relations. So "I didn't realize what I was doing would be a problem" is a tough sell for him. In fact, you yourself provided a link to harassment law and quoted: Harassment can include “sexual harassment” or unwelcome sexual advances, requests for sexual favors, and other verbal or physical harassment of a sexual nature. At the least, we've got unwelcome sexual advances (they felt trapped and pushed into it) and requests for sexual favours (naked pics).

And that really is my last word on the topic. Unless someone can come up with another source of information, I really cannot read Lewin as anything other than exploitative. Intentional or not, he had every opportunity to know better.

 

[WWGD]

That's highly improbable, so, congrats!

It depends on how much toast he eats. I don't eat that much toast, mostly when I go out.

 

[zoobyshoe]

That's highly improbable, so, congrats!

It doesn't mean I haven't, just that I don't recall ever having done it. So, if I had, I suppose I didn't think it was a very important event.

 

[zoobyshoe]

It depends on how much toast he eats. I don't eat that much toast, mostly when I go out.

I pretty much have toast every day.

 

[WWGD]

I pretty much have toast every day.

Then I am toast.

 

[Ibix]

Then I am toast.

Sounds like the strap line for some cod eastern mystic movie. "To understand the toast, you must first become the toast".

 

[WWGD]

Sounds like the strap line for some cod eastern mystic movie. "To understand the toast, you must first become the toast".

And if you combine it with the previous Buddhist monk theme, then I will become the toast within (but without butter, the butter within).

 

[Ibix]

And if you combine it with the previous Buddhist monk theme, then I will become the toast within (but without butter, the butter within).

Butter without toast? But your fingers would get greasy.

(With apologies to the late Sir PTerry).

 

[zoobyshoe]

Sounds like the strap line for some cod eastern mystic movie. "To understand the toast, you must first become the toast".

To me, it's suggests a paraphrase of Dali:

"I do not eat toast. I am toast!"

(Dali actually said: "I do not take drugs. I am drugs!")

 

[Silicon Waffle]

I would like to add a palm tree e.g 🌴 or other cute images representable with Unicode into my message but the forum engine text parser filters then cancels them out.

 

[dkotschessaa]

While playing and whiteboarding away with knot theory (this I consider my "downtime" from more formal study) I am listening to all 9 of Beethoven's symphonies. until I can start to recognize them. I "know" 1 2 and 3 sort of. We are all too familiar with the motif of 5 but not much beyond that and I think I will know 9 when I hear it.

It's a nice afternoon in Florida for once. Windows open, fresh air, music, ahh

 

[Jonathan Scott]

While playing and whiteboarding away with knot theory (this I consider my "downtime" from more formal study) I am listening to all 9 of Beethoven's symphonies. until I can start to recognize them. I "know" 1 2 and 3 sort of. We are all too familiar with the motif of 5 but not much beyond that and I think I will know 9 when I hear it.

It's a nice afternoon in Florida for once. Windows open, fresh air, music, ahh

On 21st March 2015 my wife and I were in an orchestra playing all 9 symphonies in a series of four concerts on the same day (as described on the beethovathon.com website). We had played all except 9th before. Ending of 9th was a bit chaotic (we were a bit tired by then) but it was very enjoyable (and raised quite a bit for charity).

It's unusually mild for December here in the UK. Recent lowest overnight temperatures have only been down to around 11C/52F which hasn't happened for many years.

 

[Ibix]

We are all too familiar with the motif of 5

One of the most annoying ringtones ever is a male voice singing the words "answer the phone" to the opening two repetitions of the motif from Beethoven's fifth. It's worse than the crazy frog.

 

[WWGD]

To me, it's suggests a paraphrase of Dali:

"I do not eat toast. I am toast!"

(Dali actually said: "I do not take drugs. I am drugs!")

That reminds me of once when I was planning to walk back home at around 2 a.m., someone warned me of all the weirdos that were out at this time.
I replied: I _am_ one of the weirdos people warn others about.

 

[WWGD]

One of the most annoying ringtones ever is a male voice singing the words "answer the phone" to the opening two repetitions of the motif from Beethoven's fifth. It's worse than the crazy frog.

Ah, I have heard of it sung to the words of " Nobody's home , Nobody's Home"?

 

[dkotschessaa]

On 21st March 2015 my wife and I were in an orchestra playing all 9 symphonies in a series of four concerts on the same day (as described on the beethovathon.com website). We had played all except 9th before. Ending of 9th was a bit chaotic (we were a bit tired by then) but it was very enjoyable (and raised quite a bit for charity).

Well done! I couldn't even *listen* to all 9 symphonies in one day.

It's unusually mild for December here in the UK. Recent lowest overnight temperatures have only been down to around 11C/52F which hasn't happened for many years.

I moved to Florida for love and not for the weather. But at this time of year, I really enjoy both.

-Dave K

 

[WWGD]

<Snip>
It's unusually mild for December here in the UK. Recent lowest overnight temperatures have only been down to around 11C/52F which hasn't happened for many years.

Same here in NYC, most of the U.S, I think. In the mid 50s for the whole next week . Global warming, I guess, let's enjoy it before it comes into full-blown effecr. It will be around 2100 by then, so we won't be affected by it. Of course I know there are immediate consequences for, e.g., the water cycle, but, what are you going to do?

 

[dkotschessaa]

One of the most annoying ringtones ever is a male voice singing the words "answer the phone" to the opening two repetitions of the motif from Beethoven's fifth. It's worse than the crazy frog.

Worse even than:


?

 

[Ibix]

I find myself glad that Geico is not a company with a presence in the UK...

 

[zoobyshoe]

I'm happy to say the weather in San Diego has been properly wet and nippy for this time of year.

 

[WWGD]

I'm happy to say the weather in San Diego has been properly wet and nippy for this time of year.

Wet, obviously rain then? Finally.

 

[zoobyshoe]

Wet, obviously rain then? Finally.

It has actually been raining a lot this year, but it is always short of duration and light. It's better than no rain, but it's not the cure we need. It has probably merely slowed the rate at which the deep ground moisture is being depleted.

 

[WWGD]

So much for the unseasonably warm weather: gusts of brutally cold, cutting wind are undoing any effects
of warmer temperature.

 

[lisab]

hmmm
there's a word for that

Callipigyan ?

English has a word for *every*thing.

 

[WWGD]

English has a word for *every*thing.

It also has a word for *no*thing :).