Representing sum of cosine and sine as a single cosine expression

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around representing the sum of cosine and sine functions as a single cosine expression, specifically in the form a.cos(wt) + b.sin(wt) = M.cos(wt + ϕ). Participants explore how to derive the values of M and ϕ in terms of a and b, engaging in both derivation and verification of these expressions.

Discussion Character

  • Technical explanation
  • Mathematical reasoning
  • Debate/contested

Main Points Raised

  • One participant asks for the expressions for M and ϕ in terms of a and b.
  • Another participant provides the cosine addition formula as a starting point for the derivation.
  • Several participants suggest that M = sqrt(a^2 + b^2) and ϕ = arctan(-b/a), but express uncertainty about these results.
  • One participant encourages others to derive the results independently, suggesting that corrections can be made to any mistakes found in their work.
  • Another participant confirms the derivation presented by a peer, stating there is nothing wrong with it.
  • Some participants express frustration with those who seek solutions without attempting the problem themselves, emphasizing the importance of personal effort in learning.
  • Alternative approaches to deriving M and ϕ are mentioned, including evaluating specific values of t to relate a and b to M and ϕ.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

While some participants confirm the derived expressions for M and ϕ, there remains uncertainty and differing opinions on the necessity of personal effort in solving such problems. The discussion does not reach a consensus on the best approach to the derivation.

Contextual Notes

Participants assume M is always positive and keep any negativity in the phase angle ϕ. There are also references to specific mathematical identities and their applications, but no resolution of potential misunderstandings or errors in derivations is provided.

hkBattousai
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a.cos(wt) + b.sin(wt) = M.cos(wt + ϕ)

Can you give me M and ϕ in terms of a and b?
 
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cos(u+v)=cos(u)cos(v)-sin(u)sin(v)

That 's all you need.
 
The final representation was something like
M = sqrt(a^2 + b^2)
and
ϕ = arctan(-b/a)
but I'm no sure.

Can anyone confirm it for me?
 
hkBattousai said:
The final representation was something like
M = sqrt(a^2 + b^2)
and
ϕ = arctan(-b/a)
but I'm no sure.

Can anyone confirm it for me?
No.

Try to do it for yourself, and we can correct whatever mistakes you make.
 
Code:
M.cos(wt + ϕ) = a.cos(wt) + b.sin(wt)

cos(wt + ϕ) = (a/M).cos(wt) + (b/M).sin(wt)...(I)

cos(wt + ϕ) = cos(wt).cos(ϕ) - sin(wt).sin(ϕ)...(II)

From (I) and (II),
cos(ϕ) = (a/M)
sin(ϕ) = -(b/M)

cos^2(ϕ) + sin^2(ϕ) = (a^2 + b^2)/(M^2) = 1

We assume that M is always positive and we keep any negativity in the phase angle ϕ,
M = sqrt(a^2 + b^2)

sin(ϕ)/cos(ϕ) = tan(ϕ) = -(b/M)/(a/M) = -b/a

tan(ϕ) = -b/a   ==>   ϕ = arctan(-b/a)

Is there anything wrong in my derivation?
 
hkBattousai said:
Code:
M.cos(wt + ϕ) = a.cos(wt) + b.sin(wt)

cos(wt + ϕ) = (a/M).cos(wt) + (b/M).sin(wt)...(I)

cos(wt + ϕ) = cos(wt).cos(ϕ) - sin(wt).sin(ϕ)...(II)

From (I) and (II),
cos(ϕ) = (a/M)
sin(ϕ) = -(b/M)

cos^2(ϕ) + sin^2(ϕ) = (a^2 + b^2)/(M^2) = 1

We assume that M is always positive and we keep any negativity in the phase angle ϕ,
M = sqrt(a^2 + b^2)

sin(ϕ)/cos(ϕ) = tan(ϕ) = -(b/M)/(a/M) = -b/a

tan(ϕ) = -b/a   ==>   ϕ = arctan(-b/a)

Is there anything wrong in my derivation?

No. :smile:
 
I liked your way of "you must do it yourself if you want to success"... :)
 
hkBattousai said:
I liked your way of "you must do it yourself if you want to success"... :)

It's true, isn't it? :smile:
 
Yeah, either I don't like the ones who ask a big problem and wait for others to solve it for him.
In my question, this is a simple trigonometric identity, I expected a mathematician to write it for me since most of math guys have memorized and actively use these kind of identities.
 
  • #11
You could also do the following:

t=0 gives a=M cos(ϕ),
t=pi/(2w) gives b=-M sin(ϕ).

Hence

a^2+b^2=M^2,
tan(ϕ)=-b/a.
 
  • #12
Landau said:
You could also do the following:

t=0 gives a=M cos(ϕ),
t=pi/(2w) gives b=-M sin(ϕ).

Hence

a^2+b^2=M^2,
tan(ϕ)=-b/a.

Wow, that's super simple, thanks!
 

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