Rolling Friction: How Does it Affect the Velocity of a Sphere?

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the effects of rolling friction on the velocity of a sphere, particularly in the context of programming a function to calculate the new velocity after a period of time, considering various factors such as friction, surface inclination, and environmental conditions. The scope includes theoretical considerations, practical applications, and experimental suggestions.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Technical explanation
  • Experimental/applied

Main Points Raised

  • IMK seeks assistance in creating a function to compute the new velocity of a rolling sphere affected by friction and surface inclination.
  • Some participants propose that if the sphere is rolling perfectly, it would theoretically continue indefinitely without being slowed by friction, which only ensures rolling rather than sliding.
  • Others highlight that real-world factors like air resistance and surface deformations contribute to energy loss, separate from friction.
  • One participant suggests creating a "fake friction force" to account for energy losses due to various factors, questioning whether this force should be proportional to velocity, normal force, or follow another rule.
  • A hypothesis is presented that the slowdown force may be proportional to velocity, based on observations of rolling objects compared to sliding ones.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express differing views on the role of friction in rolling motion, with some asserting it does not slow the sphere while others acknowledge real-world factors that do contribute to deceleration. The discussion remains unresolved regarding the exact nature of the forces at play and how to model them accurately.

Contextual Notes

There are limitations regarding assumptions about ideal conditions versus real-world scenarios, as well as the dependence on definitions of friction and energy loss mechanisms. The discussion does not resolve how to incorporate these factors into the proposed function.

IMK
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Hello,

I am writing a simple programme and need a function for friction acting on a rolling sphere and I am not sure how to go about it so can you help please.

The environment will be a sphere rolling across a horizontal surface of friction f at a velocity of.v and I wish to compute the new v after a period of time t.

I guess v will be in m/s, t will be in seconds or a fraction of and f will be the friction factor where 0 is none and 1 what arrest the sphere instantly. Thus

Newv = FunctionForFriction( v , t , f )

Then if it does not make the function much more complex it would be nice if I could vary the inclination of the surface the sphere is rolling across. Where i is the inclination of the surface in degrees, thus 45 would be up hill and -45 would be down hill.

Newv = FunctionForFriction( v , t , f , i )

Also I assume that this will be in a vacuum and therefore air resistance need not be considered.

Many thanks in advance IMK
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The thing is, if the ball is "rolling" perfectly, then theoretically it would keep rolling forever. The friction doesn't actually slow down the ball once it is rolling - it just makes sure that the ball is rolling instead of sliding. In real life, the air resistance and small deformations of the ball and surface are what slows it down. For example a soccer ball rolling along a pitch will lose energy crumpling blades of grass it rolls over. That crinkling is separate from friction though.
 
maze said:
The thing is, if the ball is "rolling" perfectly, then theoretically it would keep rolling forever. The friction doesn't actually slow down the ball once it is rolling - it just makes sure that the ball is rolling instead of sliding. In real life, the air resistance and small deformations of the ball and surface are what slows it down. For example a soccer ball rolling along a pitch will lose energy crumpling blades of grass it rolls over. That crinkling is separate from friction though.

Maze, many thanks for the correction.
Then how do I apply the above to my requirment then please.
Many thanks IMK
 
You could make a fake "friction force" to approximately account for all the energy loss due to air resistance, deformations, etc etc. I'm not sure if the net slowdown force goes proportional to the velocity of the ball like air resistance, or if it goes proportional to the normal force on the ball like friction, or if it obeys some other rules, or if the form of the equation depends on what type of surface you are rolling on.

This would make an interesting experiment actually - to go roll some balls along the grass with a stopwatch and distance markings and figure out how it works.

My hypothesis would be that the slowdown force goes proportional to the velocity, since from experience it seems like a rolling golf ball or soccer ball spends a disproportionate amount of time rolling really slowly right before it stops, as compared to a sliding block which seems to spend more of its time going fast and then stop abruptly.
 
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