Running a vehicle by burning aluminium?

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the feasibility of using aluminum as a fuel source for running vehicles, particularly through combustion methods such as electric arcs and thermite reactions. Participants explore the energy density of aluminum, potential applications, and challenges associated with recycling and efficiency.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Technical explanation
  • Debate/contested

Main Points Raised

  • Some participants note that aluminum has the highest energy density per unit volume of any material and can be smelted using green electricity.
  • There are suggestions to burn aluminum wires by creating an electric arc, with the hope that high temperatures would allow aluminum oxide to vaporize instead of forming a coating.
  • Participants discuss the potential to convert light and heat from the combustion into electricity via photovoltaic cells and thermocouples to power a vehicle.
  • Concerns are raised about the practicality of recycling aluminum oxide compared to using readily available aluminum ores, suggesting that large-scale reduction processes may be necessary.
  • Some propose that using the energy from combustion might be more effectively harnessed through conventional heat engines or by utilizing aluminum powder as a fuel for boilers.
  • References are made to the high temperatures achieved in iron thermite reactions, with a mention of aluminum thermite producing explosive reactions when interacting with ice.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express a mix of ideas regarding the practicality and efficiency of using aluminum as a fuel source, with no clear consensus on the best approach or method. Some acknowledge the theoretical potential while highlighting significant practical challenges.

Contextual Notes

Participants note limitations related to the recycling process of aluminum oxide and the need for large-scale operations, as well as the efficiency of different energy conversion methods, which remain unresolved.

johne1618
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Apparently aluminium has the highest energy density per unit volume of any material.

It can be smelted from ore or recycled oxide using green electricity.

People have made batteries using aluminium but they have problems like getting gunked up with Aluminium hydroxide etc.

How about burning two aluminium wires by striking up an electric arc between them?

If the temperature is high enough I guess the aluminium oxide will come off as a vapour rather than coating the wires and stopping the combustion.

The light and heat could be turned into electricity using photovoltaic cells and thermocouples and could be used to run an electric motor to drive a vehicle.

The oxide ash could be captured and recycled.
 
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johne1618 said:
Apparently aluminium has the highest energy density per unit volume of any material.

It can be smelted from ore or recycled oxide using green electricity.

People have made batteries using aluminium but they have problems like getting gunked up with Aluminium hydroxide etc.

How about burning two aluminium wires by striking up an electric arc between them?

If the temperature is high enough I guess the aluminium oxide will come off as a vapour rather than coating the wires and stopping the combustion.

The light and heat could be turned into electricity using photovoltaic cells and thermocouples and could be used to run an electric motor to drive a vehicle.

The oxide ash could be captured and recycled.

Nothing wrong with this in principle but, in practice, there would be many difficulties. Re-cycling Aluminium Oxide may not be as good value as using the vast quantities of readily available Aluminium Ores (however offensive that may seem) because you would have to harvest small quantities of waste from all the engines and get it to the sources of green electricity. To be worth while, I think the reduction process needs to be done on a big scale.
Also, using the energy from the 'flame' might be better achieved with a conventional Heat Engine. Perhaps an Aluminium Powder fuel could be used to fuel a boiler?
 
Iron thermite is VERY hot: Fe2O3 + 2 Al → 2 Fe + Al2O3
 
Poor man's welding kit. Watched some rails being welded together once. Very impressive. But high thermodynamic efficiency - if only you could make a suitable engine / cycle.
 
Bob S said:
Iron thermite is VERY hot: Fe2O3 + 2 Al → 2 Fe + Al2O3

Also Aluminum thermite ...makes a wonderful explosion when coupled to ice...as shown by Mythbusters here (wait 'til end of clip):


Care to speculate why.?

Creator
 
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