Signals Energy of 2 signals - Integral limits correct?

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Homework Help Overview

The discussion revolves around the energy of two orthogonal signals, x(t) and y(t), and the implications of their orthogonality on the integral limits during the calculation of the total energy of the combined signal z(t) = x(t) + y(t).

Discussion Character

  • Conceptual clarification, Mathematical reasoning, Assumption checking

Approaches and Questions Raised

  • Participants explore the mathematical proof of energy conservation for orthogonal signals and question the validity of integration by parts in this context. There is also a query about the integral of the product of the two signals and its implications.

Discussion Status

The discussion is ongoing, with participants providing insights into the definition of orthogonality and its relevance to the integral of the product of the signals. Some participants express confusion regarding the integration limits and the application of integration by parts.

Contextual Notes

There is a noted concern about the integration limits being appropriate for the variables involved, particularly regarding the integration with respect to time versus another variable.

thomas49th
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If signals x(t) and y(t) are orthogonal and if z(t) = x(t) + y(t) then
E_{z} = E_{x} + E_{y}:


Proof:

E_{z} =&gt; \int^{\infty}_{-\infty} {(x(t) + y(t))^{2}} dt<br /> =&gt; \int {(x(t) + y(t))^{2}}^{2} dt<br /> =&gt; \int (x^{2}(t)) + \int(y^{2}(t))dt + \int x(t)y(t)dt<br /> =&gt; E_{x} + E_{y}<br />

because \int x(t)y(t)dt = 0 because of integration by parts:

u = x(t) dv/dt = y(t)
u' = dx/dt, v = frac{y^{2}(t)}{2}

so x(t)\frac{y^{2}(t)}{2} - \int {\frac{y^{2}(t)}{2}\frac{dx}{dt}}dt
x(t)\frac{y^{2}(t)}{2} - \int {\frac{y^{2}(t)}{2}}dx
we can treat y^2(t) as a constant so:

x(t)\frac{y^{2}(t)}{2} - \int^{\infty}_{-\infty} {\frac{y^{2}(t)}{2}}dx
x(t)\frac{y^{2}(t)}{2} - } [{\frac{y^{2}(t)x}{2}}]^{\infty t}_{-\infty t}

but the problem is that the limits were destined for integrating with respect to time. I'm not integrating with respect to x.

Any suggestions?
Thanks
Thomas
 
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The integral of x(t)y(t) isn't zero because of some bogus 'integration by parts' argument. It's zero because that's what 'orthogonal' means.
 
Ofcourse! Execellent. May I ask, out of interest alone what the integral of x(t)y(t) with respect to t should be?

Thanks
Thomas
 
thomas49th said:
Ofcourse! Execellent. May I ask, out of interest alone what the integral of x(t)y(t) with respect to t should be?

Thanks
Thomas

There's really nothing in particular you can say about it without knowing more about x(t) and y(t). y(t)dt can't be integrated to y(t)^2/2. That's y(t)dy(t). So integration by parts isn't useful.
 

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