Solve Lagrangian Oscillator: Damped, Driven System

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Homework Help Overview

The discussion revolves around a driven, damped harmonic oscillator, specifically whether the equation of motion can be solved using Lagrangian mechanics. The original poster is familiar with solving the system using differential equations but seeks to understand the Lagrangian approach as they have recently started learning about it.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory, Conceptual clarification, Problem interpretation

Approaches and Questions Raised

  • Participants discuss the inclusion of driving and damping forces in the Lagrangian formulation. One participant suggests considering the displacement as relative to an oscillating support, while another notes the challenge of incorporating damping in Lagrangian mechanics.

Discussion Status

The discussion is ongoing, with participants exploring different interpretations of how to approach the problem. Some guidance has been provided regarding the formulation of the Lagrangian, but the complexities of damping remain a point of contention.

Contextual Notes

There is mention of advanced techniques, such as half derivatives, which may not be suitable for basic courses in Lagrangian mechanics. The original poster's inquiry is framed within the context of their current learning stage.

tburke2
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Homework Statement


I'm given a driven, dampened harmonic oscillator (can it be thought of as a spring-mass system with linear friction?) Is it possible to solve the equation of motion using Lagrangian mechanics? I could solve it with the usual differential equation x''+βx'+ωₒ²x=fₒcos(ωt) but as we have just started learning Lagrangian in class I'd like to do it that way.

Homework Equations


x''+βx'+ωₒ²x=fₒcos(ωt)

The Attempt at a Solution


I know how to do it with an undampened, undriven spring-mass system but am unsure how to include the energies for the driving force and damping force.

For undampended and undriven:
L= 1/2mx'² - 1/2kx²
 
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There are ways of including half derivatives in time which will let you do this but it is significantly more advanced than your typical basic course in Lagrangian mechanics. The usual treatment cannot deal with dissipative systems.
 
Hi tburke2,

I believe that you can solve the system by considering the displacement x of the particle as the displacement from some support that oscillates in the same way as your forcing.

This would lead to a lagrangian of:
L =1/2mx'^2 - 1/2kx^2
were x = x_o - z, where x_o = F_o cos(wt) and z is the actual displacement of your forcing. Of course, this is only valid for some kind of mechanical forcing. I would recommend reading Morin Classical Mechanics as it covers Lagrangian Mechanics is a good level of detail.
 
PhysyCola said:
This would lead to a lagrangian of:
L =1/2mx'^2 - 1/2kx^2
were x = x_o - z, where x_o = F_o cos(wt) and z is the actual displacement of your forcing. Of course, this is only valid for some kind of mechanical forcing. I would recommend reading Morin Classical Mechanics as it covers Lagrangian Mechanics is a good level of detail.

This does not involve any damping, which is a dissipative effect and what the OP was asking for.
 

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