Store wood in old salt mines to reduce CO2 in the atmosphere

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the idea of storing cut trees in old salt mines as a method to reduce atmospheric CO2 levels. Participants explore the feasibility of this approach, its implications for forest ecosystems, and alternative carbon sequestration strategies, including biochar and the use of wood in construction.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Debate/contested
  • Technical explanation
  • Conceptual clarification

Main Points Raised

  • Some participants argue that cutting trees and storing them in salt mines may not effectively reduce CO2, as trees that are burned or left to rot release CO2 back into the atmosphere.
  • Concerns are raised about the stability of salt mines if flooded with seawater, as seawater can dissolve salt and potentially destabilize the structure.
  • Others suggest that planting new trees might be a simpler and more effective solution for carbon sequestration.
  • There is a discussion about the ecological roles of old trees in forests, emphasizing that they contribute to forest health and biodiversity.
  • Biochar is proposed as a long-term carbon sequestration strategy that could enhance soil quality and reduce CO2 emissions, with some participants noting its potential economic benefits.
  • Participants discuss the energy requirements and byproducts of biochar production, with some indicating that certain pyrolysis processes can be self-sustaining.
  • Some contributions highlight the importance of circular material strategies in carbon management, suggesting that byproducts from biochar production could have market value.
  • There are suggestions to shift forestry practices to more temperate regions for faster tree growth and to use wood in construction instead of concrete.
  • Some participants mention existing practices of storing wood in salt mines in the form of paper, questioning the relevance of the proposed idea.
  • Concerns are raised about the energy costs associated with burying charcoal and the need for a balance between carbon offsetting and fossil fuel consumption.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express multiple competing views regarding the effectiveness of storing trees in salt mines for carbon sequestration, with no consensus reached on the best approach. There is ongoing debate about the ecological implications of cutting trees versus alternative methods like biochar and planting new trees.

Contextual Notes

Participants note the complexity of carbon cycling in forests and the potential ecological impacts of removing trees. Discussions also highlight the energy costs associated with various carbon sequestration methods, indicating that assumptions about energy inputs and outputs are critical to the feasibility of proposed solutions.

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  • #32
In the interest of rescuing this thread...yes, burying wood can be a form of carbon sequestration, as long as it’s buried in a way that prevents it from rotting (and thus releasing its carbon back into the atmosphere). This—albeit on a much slower timescale—is basically how fossil fuels came to exist in the first place. In addition, there’s plenty of waste wood from industrial lumber processes that could be a good candidate.

The problem isn’t the science; the problem is the economics. You can use waste wood for a number of things (including burning it for energy) that you can presumably sell at a profit (or at least mitigate a loss). Sending waste wood to a regular landfill will just allow it to decompose and release its carbon. So there would have to be a dedicated infrastructure for burial of wood. We have similar dedicated infrastructures for special waste streams—in particular, recycling centers and hazmat disposal centers—but in the first case, the end product can, at least in theory, be resold at a profit, and in the second case, there is a clear immediate danger to public health. With wood burial, neither of those apply, so there’s no economic incentive.

Which means that an incentive must be artificially supplied: then the issue becomes political. Probably the easiest way to incentivize carbon sequestration is through a carbon tax, and wood burial could be rolled into this as a specialized form of sequestration. If the legal framework allows it (e.g., carbon offset trading), you could conceivably see companies pop up that grow and bury a fast-growing plant like bamboo and sell the offsets at a profit to major polluters.
 
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  • #33
There will come a time when the process of filling the mine with wood will become carbon neutral and economically optimum. Now is NOT that time.
Filling the mine now would be carbon inefficient. It would be better to delay the process until excess renewable (electric?) energy was available to power all the vehicles needed to transport and bury the material.
 
  • #34
TeethWhitener said:
The problem isn’t the science; the problem is the economics.

Yes, the key is economics. You can cover costs using heat for any number of industrial purposes from producing charcoal. This by itself could keep some fossil fuels in the ground.

The benefits of charcoal (and also its stability) gives it a potential role in sequestration.

Economically, all we need to resource is the production and sequestration of 1 tonne of charcoal per person per year and less if we accelerate other renewables.

Most nations should be able to produce a 20kg bag of charcoal per week for each of their citizens. It would require some diversion of labour but nothing that has not occurred during wars. 20kg bags are already available in BBQ supply outlets.

A total rollout of electric and hydrogen powered vehicles, will make the task even easier.
 
  • #35
charles65 said:
Most nations should be able to produce a 20kg bag of charcoal per week for each of their citizens.
That's about multiplying the food production by three to fivefold, at the very least.

Not gonna' happen: not without excess carbon footprint increase with an even higher multiplier: not in any sustainable way: not in any economically acceptable way.

You have absolutely no idea what you are talking about.
 
  • #36
This thread has run its course. Time to close.

Thanks to all that have participated.
 
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