The Highest Point for bouncing Mac Application Icons

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the behavior of Mac application icons when they bounce in the dock, specifically questioning whether their velocity is zero at the highest point of the bounce. Participants explore analogies with LED lights and consider how velocity is defined in discrete cases, as well as the implications of sampling rates on perceived motion.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Technical explanation
  • Conceptual clarification
  • Debate/contested

Main Points Raised

  • One participant suggests that the velocity of the bouncing icon may not reach zero at the highest point, proposing that if one were to capture every frame, it might be possible to find identical frames where the icon appears stationary.
  • Another participant argues that to transition from positive to negative velocity, the velocity must pass through zero, indicating that a bouncing ball must stop at its highest point before descending.
  • A different viewpoint raises the question of how to define velocity in discrete cases, suggesting that the velocity could be considered zero for the duration of each frame before switching to the next frame.
  • One participant discusses the concept of reconstructing sampled motion, referencing the Nyquist criterion and the use of low pass filters to create the illusion of continuous motion from discrete samples.
  • Another participant comments on the need for high sampling rates, stating that perfect reconstruction does not require infinite frame rates, as lower rates could suffice.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express differing views on whether the velocity of the icon is zero at its highest point, with some supporting the idea that it must pass through zero and others questioning this assumption based on discrete sampling. The discussion remains unresolved with multiple competing perspectives.

Contextual Notes

Participants highlight limitations in defining velocity in discrete cases and the implications of sampling rates on motion perception, but do not resolve these issues.

dakota224
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When Mac application icons are bouncing in the dock, does their velocity = 0 at their highest point?

Here's what it looks like when you open a new application for Mac if you're not familiar.
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Another way I'm thinking about it: What if you have a strip of LED lights and its on a chase pattern going back and forth. Would the velocity of the 'whatever' going back and forth drop to 0 when it switched direction? And isn't that essentially what the app icon is? LEDs lighting up/down?

One answer I've gotten in discussion: "So let's say you capture every frame of the icon moving up and down. You flip through them one at a time. You may or may not see two identical frames where the icon stays put. But if you could render at an infinite frame rate, eventually you would find two identical frames where the icon hadn't moved. I think the simplest answer is graph velocity vs time. When moving up you have a positive velocity and when moving down you have a negative velocity. Move your finger along that graph from the positive to the negative and never cross through zero. Good luck with that."
 
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dakota224 said:
Another way I'm thinking about it: What if you have a strip of LED lights and its on a chase pattern going back and forth. Would the velocity of the 'whatever' going back and forth drop to 0 when it switched direction? And isn't that essentially what the app icon is? LEDs lighting up/down?
Why overcomplicate things?
Like the answer you've received states, to transition from positive to negative velocity you must pass through zero.
That is,a bouncing ball moving upwards must come to a stop before it can move downward. And of course that is the highest point the ball reaches and it could be shown by integrating v(t) to get d(t), the maxima and minima of d(t) will coincidence with the points where v(t)=0.
 
dakota224 said:
When Mac application icons are bouncing in the dock, does their velocity = 0 at their highest point?
Ho do you define velocity for dicrete cases like this? You could argue the velocity is 0 at every frame, for the duration of a frame, and then switches to the next frame.
 
The sampled motion can (ideally) be reconstructed in your brain (or by computer) using the samples to create the effect of continuous motion again. All that's necessary is for the sampling to be at a high enough rate (see Nyquist criterion). An appropriate low pass filter is the required (interpolating) function to perform on the samples and it can produce a point in the motion that is actually higher than the two points on either side. The same principle applies to all signal sampling and reconstitution - spatial (digital photographs) , temporal (digital music) or both together (digital TV).
 
dakota224 said:
But if you could render at an infinite frame rate, eventually you would find two identical frames where the icon hadn't moved.
I just read this again. You don't actually need to sample this fast to be able to get perfect reconstruction. It would be way over the top, to send or store so many samples. (GB/s, when kB/s would do).
 

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