Why Does Snow Pack Better Near the Melting Point?

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  • Thread starter Thread starter Charles Link
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SUMMARY

The discussion centers on the optimal conditions for packing snow to create a snowman, specifically emphasizing that snow packs best when temperatures are just above freezing. The unique properties of water, including its expansion upon freezing, play a crucial role in this process. Participants share personal experiences, noting that wet snow, which typically occurs near the melting point, is essential for effective packing. The conversation also highlights misconceptions about snow packing, with some contributors arguing that the wetness of the snow is more significant than temperature alone.

PREREQUISITES
  • Understanding of thermodynamics, particularly phase changes of water.
  • Familiarity with the properties of snow, including wet and dry snow characteristics.
  • Knowledge of basic meteorological concepts related to temperature and precipitation.
  • Experience with snow-related activities, such as building snowmen or snowball fights.
NEXT STEPS
  • Research the thermodynamic properties of water and how they affect snow formation.
  • Explore the relationship between snow moisture content and temperature for optimal packing.
  • Investigate the physics of snowball formation and the role of pressure in snow compaction.
  • Learn about different types of snow and their implications for winter activities.
USEFUL FOR

This discussion is beneficial for winter sports enthusiasts, meteorologists, educators teaching about phase changes, and anyone interested in the science behind snow and its properties.

  • #61
Folks were making snowmen on our street but no one knew you had to start with a snowball and roll it around to make a big ball. Instead they just packed the snow together to make it and of course it just didn't look right.

One kid made an angry bird snowman such imagination.

We got 3" of snow in Austin Tx. It started as rain to sleet to snow so it rolled really well stripping all the snow right off of the grass. I was really surprised. I did one roll and gave it to a family building a small snowman for their two year old son.
 
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  • #63
Some great snowmen here! But it surprises me a bit that I haven't yet seen a snowman dressed in Winter 20-21 style, wearing a face mask.
 
  • #64
I’ve seen a couple of local snowmen with surgical masks.
 
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  • #65
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  • #66
The above (post 65) is a photo of a 4'3" snowman that I made today, Tuesday 3-16-21, from snow that fell yesterday, but it was too cold to pack. It warmed up above freezing today, about 38 degrees, and the snow packed very easily.
 
  • #67
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  • #68
The above is a snowman that I made today, Tuesday 12-28-21. It measures 3 feet 10 inches tall. It is the first one of the season here in Chicago.
 
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  • #69
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  • #70
The above snowman is one I assembled today Wednesday February 2. It is the second one of the season and is 3' 10" tall. We had 6" of snow in Chicago today, but at 24 degrees, it was too cold to pack. This one took a little more planning than most of them, and the reader might find the details of interest: The snowballs for the snowman came from snow that was on the ground 2 days ago from a previous snowfall about a week ago. It was 38 degrees two days ago, and it packed very well. Yesterday it was 46 degrees with rain, so I covered the snowballs with plastic, and today, when the temperature was 24 degrees, I stacked them into a snowman. I didn't have any snow that would pack well to cement the layers together, so I used dowel rod to hold the snowballs in place.
 
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  • #71
Send some of that snow down here to Louisiana!
 
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  • #72
Dowel rod ==> giving my snowman a little backbone.

Nice touch!

I know stuff we did with snowballs was to have a pail of water to dunk the snowball in. Downside is very cold fingers but great ice balls.

Nowadays maybe a combination of thick rubber gloves (not latex although they might be more flexible and not break) over snow gloves would mitigate the cold fingers problem.
 
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  • #73
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  • #74
The photo above is a 3'6" snowman that I made today Sunday 2-27-22 from snow that fell a couple days ago. It was too cold for packing when it fell (26 degrees), but the temperatures are near 40 degrees today in Chicago, and it packed very well.
 
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  • #75
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  • #76
The above photo is a 5'0" snowman that I made today, Monday March 7. The snow packed very well with temperatures around 35 degrees in Chicago, and it took me only about 20 minutes to make.
 
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  • #77
How does Mr Snowman feel about his height? Is that with or without the cap on top?
 
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  • #78
jedishrfu said:
How does Mr Snowman feel about his height? Is that with or without the cap on top?
@jedishrfu This one is a full 60"=5'0" without the cap. :-)
 
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  • #79
jedishrfu said:
How does Mr Snowman feel about his height?
A lady never tells!
 
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  • #80
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  • #81
The above is a photo of the 3'8" snowman I made today, Tuesday November 15, 2022, in Chicago, as we had our first snowfall of the season. The snow packed well with temperatures about 35 degrees.
 
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  • #82
We're waiting for a chance of snow tonight. Meanwhile, further to the east from Chicago, we are expecting rain, which will allegedly turn to snow and then back to rain, possibly freezing rain, before just cold rain.
 
  • #83
Your snowman looks great.

Maybe you could post physicsforums sign next him and he can become our mascot. @Greg Bernhardt would like that.

We're flying to upstate NY Albany-Schenectady-Troy area tomorrow and hoping there's no snow.
 
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  • #84
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  • #85
The above post is a photo of a 5'0" snowman that I made today, Wednesday December 28, 2022, from snow that had fallen December 22nd. The snow was too cold to pack on that day (in Chicago), but now the temperatures are finally above freezing, and today it got up to 40 degrees and it packed very readily.
 
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  • #86
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  • #87
The above photo is a 3'8" snowman that I made today, Sunday January 22, 2023, in Chicago. The snow packed well with temperatures just above freezing.
 
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  • #88
During the Christmas-week cold snap we got maybe 2 inches of snow and the thermometer was -12F at 10pm. I went for a walk and was delighted to become re-acquainted with (really loud) dry squeaky snow.... -squeak- -squeak- -squeak- -squeak- -squeak- -squeak- -squeak- -squeak-

I think it may have been particularly loud because the ground was not very wet and the frost line not very deep......maybe a resonator?
 
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  • #89
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  • #90
The above is a photo of a 5'6" snowman that I made today, Wednesday January 25, 2023, along with the one from Sunday that now measures 2'8" tall. The smaller one had toppled over on Sunday, and I reassembled it, but we also had a couple of days of milder weather. The new one was very easy to make with temperatures slightly above freezing =the snow packed well, and I had plenty of snow with the 2"-3" that fell in Chicago overnight.
 
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