Thermodynamics and Entropy: Does an Atom's Energy Decrease Over Time?

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Homework Help Overview

The discussion revolves around thermodynamics, specifically the second law of thermodynamics and its implications in scenarios involving heat transfer between water at different temperatures. Participants explore whether an engine operating between warm surface water and colder deep water violates this law. Additionally, there is a separate inquiry regarding the energy of atoms over time and its relation to entropy.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory, Conceptual clarification, Assumption checking

Approaches and Questions Raised

  • Participants attempt to relate the operation of a heat engine to the second law of thermodynamics, questioning the implications of heat flow from a colder to a warmer reservoir. Others raise questions about the nature of atomic energy and its potential decrease over time due to entropy.

Discussion Status

The discussion is ongoing, with participants seeking clarification on the relationship between heat transfer and the second law. Some have provided hints regarding the mathematical definition of entropy and its relevance to the problem, while others express uncertainty about the implications of their findings.

Contextual Notes

Participants reference the Clausius statement and the concept of entropy, indicating a focus on theoretical principles. There is a mention of historical context regarding atomic energy, suggesting a broader inquiry into fundamental physics concepts.

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Homework Statement



In the tropics, the water near the surface is warmer than the deep water. Would an engine operates between these two surfaces violates the second law? Why?

Homework Equations


Clausius statement:
Heat generally cannot flow spontaneously from a material at lower temperature to a material at higher temperature.

The Attempt at a Solution


I only knoe that the water near the surface is a high temperature reservoir and the deep water is a low temperature reservoir. Any engine only absorb heat at high temperature reservoir and do work and rejects heat at low temperature reservoir. I don't know what is the relationship of this with the second law. Thank you.
 
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I don't know what is the relationship of this with the second law.
http://hyperphysics.phy-astr.gsu.edu/hbase/hframe.html"
 
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dlgoff said:
http://hyperphysics.phy-astr.gsu.edu/hbase/hframe.html"

YES,...
But anybody can give me some hints or direction to tackle this question?
 
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Note that from the mathematical definition of entropy, a process in which heat flows from cold to hot has decreasing entropy. This can happen in a non-isolated system if entropy is created elsewhere, such that the total entropy is constant or increasing, as required by the second law.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Second_law_of_thermodynamics"
 
Last edited by a moderator:
cowcow8866 said:

Homework Statement



In the tropics, the water near the surface is warmer than the deep water. Would an engine operates between these two surfaces violates the second law? Why?

Homework Equations


Clausius statement:
Heat generally cannot flow spontaneously from a material at lower temperature to a material at higher temperature.

The Attempt at a Solution


I only knoe that the water near the surface is a high temperature reservoir and the deep water is a low temperature reservoir. Any engine only absorb heat at high temperature reservoir and do work and rejects heat at low temperature reservoir. I don't know what is the relationship of this with the second law. Thank you.
The answer is no. So long as heat flows from the warmer reservoir to the colder, there is no violation of the second law.

AM
 
I have had a simple question that has nagged me since my '60s era physics classes. Simply put, does an an atom's energy "run down" over time? e.g. Is it a constant or does it drop over time due to entropy? If it drops over time, what is the lifetime of an atom?
 

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