Thought Experiment on ToR postulate-1

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around a thought experiment related to the first postulate of the theory of relativity, specifically examining the observations made by different observers in varying inertial frames. The scope includes conceptual reasoning and the implications of Newton's laws in different contexts, including scenarios in a vacuum.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory, Conceptual clarification, Debate/contested

Main Points Raised

  • Observer A, standing still on Earth, and observer B, in a jetplane flying at mach-2, have differing observations regarding the motion of another jetplane (jetplane-2) moving at mach-1.
  • Observer B notes that jetplane-2 appears to be moving backwards relative to him, which raises questions about the validity of Newton's third law in this scenario.
  • Some participants suggest that the observations made by B can be explained by the effects of air resistance and the relative motion of the jets.
  • One participant argues that conducting the experiment in a vacuum would lead to both planes accelerating, thus making them non-inertial frames and introducing fictitious forces.
  • A participant acknowledges a misunderstanding regarding the assumptions made in the thought experiment.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express differing views on the implications of the thought experiment, particularly regarding the validity of Newton's laws in non-inertial frames and the effects of external forces. The discussion remains unresolved with multiple competing perspectives.

Contextual Notes

Limitations include assumptions about the nature of the frames of reference, the effects of air resistance versus vacuum conditions, and the implications of acceleration on the observations made by the participants.

kannank
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'All laws of physics hold good in all inertial frames of reference.'

observer A - standing still on earth
observer B - in jetplane-1 flying at mach-2

jetplane-2 is moving at mach-1 co-directional to jetplane-1.

A observes in accordance with Newton's 3rd law.

B observes, fuel level going down in jet-2, exhaust moving out from the tail. But jetplane-1 is moving backwards for him, which is not in accordance with 3rd law.

Again I know I am missing something here. Any clue what it is?

thanks.
 
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B observes that jetplane-2 is being blown backwards by the air which is rushing past him (B) at mach-2. Jetplane-2 is burning fuel in a half-successful attempt to make forward progress against this tremendous headwind.
 
I'm sorry. this sort of an invalid answer. We can experiment this in vacuum as well.
 
If you did this in vacuum, both "planes," if actively burning fuel, would be accelerating, making them non-inertial frames, in which observers will necessarily observe some sort of fictitious forces.
 
that answers me. Wrong assumption. Thank you.
 

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