Time Dilation: Biologist's Question to Math & Relativity Experts

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the concept of time dilation as it relates to the travel of an individual, referred to as Mr. 'X', to a distant star at a significant fraction of the speed of light. Participants explore the implications of special relativity, particularly concerning the relativity of time and distance, and how these concepts interact with the constancy of the speed of light.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Debate/contested
  • Conceptual clarification

Main Points Raised

  • Merwyn, a microbiologist, questions how Mr. 'X' can experience less time than what is measured on Earth, and whether distance is also relative like time.
  • Some participants assert that in Mr. 'X's frame of reference, he has not traveled the full distance to the star, but rather that the star has moved, introducing the concept of length contraction.
  • There is a suggestion that both time and space are relative concepts, which raises questions about the constancy of the speed of light when time is variable.
  • One participant emphasizes that understanding special relativity requires only basic algebra, while another notes that the understanding of these concepts can vary based on individual interpretation.
  • Another participant humorously outlines a method of Mr. 'X's travel that involves contracting and expanding distances, highlighting the complexities of measuring time and distance in relativity.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express differing views on the interpretation of time dilation and length contraction, with no consensus reached on the implications of these concepts for the constancy of the speed of light. The discussion remains unresolved regarding the relationship between relative distance and time.

Contextual Notes

Limitations include assumptions about the nature of time and distance in different frames of reference, as well as the potential misunderstanding of basic mathematical relationships in the context of relativity.

merwyn
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Iam a Microbiologist, not an expert in math and relativity. I have a simple question.

Assumption
Mr 'X' travels to the star 'S'
In Earth reference the star is 5 light years ie 9,500,000,000,000 x 5 Kms from earth
Mr X travels @ 80% of lights speed (80% speed from leaving and reaching back; Immediate acceleration)
In Earth's time Mr X returns after 12.5 (6.25x2) years traveling 9.5^13 Kms
In Mr ' X' clock, Assume, he has returned to Earth in 9 years due to time dilation.
As per Mr 'X' clock, he has traveled only 8.55^13 (9 Years X 9,500,000,000,000 kms)

Question is
1. How can it be?Whether Distance is also relative as time?
2. If Distance is relative, then how can be the speed of light is a constant?

I guess, i have made you to understand my point
Please No mathematics and calculations, Biologists are fools to understand numbers, so use simple terms like "Time runs slow @ higher speed" to explain.

With Regards
Merwyn
 
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merwyn said:
As per Mr 'X' clock, he has traveled only 8.55^13 (9 Years X 9,500,000,000,000 kms)
No, in his frame he has not traveled at all - it is the star which has moved. That being said, the star has moved a shorter distance yes. This is called length contraction. Both time and space are relative concepts.
merwyn said:
If Distance is relative, then how can be the speed of light is a constant?
Because time is also relative and velocity is distance per time.
 
@merwyn, the math needed to understand Special Relativity, which is the topic that covers what you are asking, uses only high school algebra and very little of that and there are many beginner's tutorials on the Internet.
 
phinds said:
@merwyn, the math needed to understand Special Relativity, which is the topic that covers what you are asking, uses only high school algebra and very little of that and there are many beginner's tutorials on the Internet.
Well, I would say this depends on what you mean by "understand". It is certainly enough to get the very basics though.
 
For the specific question though, anyone who passed middle school pre-algebra should be able to handle it:

d=s*t

So if s is constant and t changes, d must...?
 
merwyn said:
Iam a Microbiologist, not an expert in math and relativity. I have a simple question.

Assumption
Mr 'X' travels to the star 'S'
In Earth reference the star is 5 light years ie 9,500,000,000,000 x 5 Kms from earth
Mr X travels @ 80% of lights speed (80% speed from leaving and reaching back; Immediate acceleration)
In Earth's time Mr X returns after 12.5 (6.25x2) years traveling 9.5^13 Kms
In Mr ' X' clock, Assume, he has returned to Earth in 9 years due to time dilation.
As per Mr 'X' clock, he has traveled only 8.55^13 (9 Years X 9,500,000,000,000 kms)

Question is
1. How can it be?Whether Distance is also relative as time?
2. If Distance is relative, then how can be the speed of light is a constant?

I guess, i have made you to understand my point
Please No mathematics and calculations, Biologists are fools to understand numbers, so use simple terms like "Time runs slow @ higher speed" to explain.

With Regards
Merwyn

Mr X's traveling method was something like this:
1: Contract the distance to star S
2: Travel the contracted distance
3: Expand the distance
4: Contract the distance to Earth
5: Travel the contracted distance
6: Expand the distance
7: Declare "I traveled 10 light years in 9 years"

Everybody agrees that the clock that measured the time 9 years was shaken, therefore it was not a valid clock, except for the purpose of measuring proper time.
 
If you want to put it like that, you should do it properly:
jartsa said:
2: Travel the contracted distance
2: Let S and Earth travel the contracted distance.
jartsa said:
5: Travel the contracted distance
5: Let S and Earth travel the contracted distance.
jartsa said:
7: Declare "I traveled 10 light years in 9 years"
7: Declare "I went to that star S 5 light years away in the rest frame of the Earth and the star and I aged 9 years during my trip. Isn't time dilation wonderful?"
 

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