MHB Understanding Topology: Closure, Boundary & Open/Closed Sets

Click For Summary
The discussion centers on the concept of boundaries in topology, specifically addressing Andrew Browder's assertion that the boundary of a set E is empty if and only if E is both open and closed. A participant clarifies that while an open set does not contain its boundary points, it does not mean it has no boundary points at all. The example of the open interval (0, 1) is provided, illustrating that its boundary consists of the points {0, 1}. The conversation concludes with an acknowledgment of the clarification, reinforcing the understanding that a set being both open and closed implies it has no boundary points. Understanding these definitions is crucial for grasping topological concepts.
Math Amateur
Gold Member
MHB
Messages
3,920
Reaction score
48
I am reading Andrew Browder's book: "Mathematical Analysis: An Introduction" ... ...

I am reading Chapter 6: Topology ... ... and am currently focused on Section 6.1 Topological Spaces ...

I need some help in order to fully understand a statement by Browder in Section 6.1 ... ...


The relevant statements by Browder follow Definition 6.10 and read as follows:

View attachment 9156
View attachment 9157In the above text we read the following:

" ... ... The set $$\overline{E}$$ \ $$E^{ \circ }$$ is referred to as the boundary of $$E$$, and is denoted by $$\text{bdry } E$$; it is easy to see that $$\text{bdry } E = \emptyset$$ if and only if $$E$$ is both open and closed ... ... "My question is as follows:

Can someone explain and demonstrate rigorously how/why $$\text{bdry } E = \emptyset$$ if and only if $$E$$ is both open and closed ... ... ?
Note: I was surprised at Browder's remark above because I was always under the impression (delusion?) that an open set had an empty set as its boundary ...
Help will be appreciated ... ...

Peter======================================================================================The closure of a subset of a topological space is an important notion in the above post so I am providing Browder's definition of closure as well as a basic proposition involving closure ... as follows ...

View attachment 9158

It may help readers of the above post to have access to Browder's fundamental topological definitions ... so I am providing the same as follows ... ...

View attachment 9159
View attachment 9160
View attachment 9161Hope that helps ...

Peter
 

Attachments

  • Browder - 1 - Defn of Interior 6.10 and Relevant Remarks ... PART 1 ... ....png
    Browder - 1 - Defn of Interior 6.10 and Relevant Remarks ... PART 1 ... ....png
    11.2 KB · Views: 150
  • Browder - 2 - Defn of Interior 6.10 and Relevant Remarks ... PART 2 ... .png
    Browder - 2 - Defn of Interior 6.10 and Relevant Remarks ... PART 2 ... .png
    3.7 KB · Views: 143
  • Browder - Defn of Closure 6.7 and Relevant Propn 6.8  ... .png
    Browder - Defn of Closure 6.7 and Relevant Propn 6.8 ... .png
    21 KB · Views: 139
  • Browder - 1 - Start of 6.1 - Relevant Defns & Propns ... PART 1 ... .png
    Browder - 1 - Start of 6.1 - Relevant Defns & Propns ... PART 1 ... .png
    15.4 KB · Views: 114
  • Browder - 2 - Start of 6.1 - Relevant Defns & Propns ... PART 2 ... .png
    Browder - 2 - Start of 6.1 - Relevant Defns & Propns ... PART 2 ... .png
    18.7 KB · Views: 165
  • Browder - 3 - Start of 6.1 - Relevant Defns & Propns ... PART 3 ... .png
    Browder - 3 - Start of 6.1 - Relevant Defns & Propns ... PART 3 ... .png
    56.3 KB · Views: 148
Last edited:
Physics news on Phys.org
Note: I was surprised at Browder's remark above because I was always under the impression (delusion?) that an open set had an empty set as its boundary …


I can't say whether you are deluded or not but you are certainly wrong! Consider the "open interval" (0, 1) in R. Its closure is the closed set [0, 1]. Its boundary is {0, 1}.

What is true of an open set is that "an open set contains none of its boundary points", not that has no boundary points.

A closed set, conversely contains all of its boundary points. A set is both "open" and "closed" if and only if "none" is the same as "all". That is, if the set has no boundary points.
 
HallsofIvy said:
I can't say whether you are deluded or not but you are certainly wrong! Consider the "open interval" (0, 1) in R. Its closure is the closed set [0, 1]. Its boundary is {0, 1}.

What is true of an open set is that "an open set contains none of its boundary points", not that has no boundary points.

A closed set, conversely contains all of its boundary points. A set is both "open" and "closed" if and only if "none" is the same as "all". That is, if the set has no boundary points.
[/LEFT]
Oh yes ... of course ... you're right ...

Thanks for the clarification... it was most helpful...

Peter
 
We all know the definition of n-dimensional topological manifold uses open sets and homeomorphisms onto the image as open set in ##\mathbb R^n##. It should be possible to reformulate the definition of n-dimensional topological manifold using closed sets on the manifold's topology and on ##\mathbb R^n## ? I'm positive for this. Perhaps the definition of smooth manifold would be problematic, though.

Similar threads

Replies
3
Views
2K
  • · Replies 2 ·
Replies
2
Views
2K
Replies
7
Views
2K
  • · Replies 2 ·
Replies
2
Views
1K
  • · Replies 2 ·
Replies
2
Views
2K
  • · Replies 3 ·
Replies
3
Views
2K
Replies
2
Views
2K
Replies
2
Views
2K
Replies
2
Views
2K
  • · Replies 6 ·
Replies
6
Views
2K