Vacuum bags inflating in Cryogenic Storage

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Discussion Overview

The discussion centers around the issue of vacuum bags inflating after being removed from cryogenic storage, specifically in the context of storing materials at cryogenic temperatures in vapor phase. Participants explore various theories and hypotheses regarding the cause of this inflation, including potential mechanisms of gas exchange and the integrity of the bags.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Technical explanation
  • Debate/contested

Main Points Raised

  • One participant suggests that trapped air, liquid nitrogen ingress, holes in the bag, or poor seals could be responsible for the inflation, but they have not been able to replicate these issues in controlled tests.
  • Another participant posits that if the bag expands upon warming, it indicates a phase change from liquid or solid to gas, and recommends analyzing the gas content to determine its source.
  • A different participant raises the possibility that faulty seals could allow gaseous nitrogen and other gases to enter the vacuum bag during storage, leading to inflation when the bag is warmed.
  • The original poster acknowledges the possibility of seepage and suggests that longer experiments may be necessary to observe the gas levels that could cause the inflation.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express multiple competing views regarding the cause of the inflation, and the discussion remains unresolved with no consensus reached on the primary mechanism at play.

Contextual Notes

Limitations include the potential for undetected gas seepage over extended periods and the need for more thorough experimental conditions to replicate the inflation phenomenon.

Jimbowen1072
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I work for a company which has an interesting problem. We store at cryogenic temperatures in vapour phase, not submerged in liquid. In order to protect the inner bag we place an over wrap over the inner bag then vacuum pack it, in a sterile environment. The bag is then placed into cryogenic storage. Our problem is that randomly one of the bags inflates when being removed from cryogenic storage.
Theories that surround this include trapped air, liquid nitrogen getting into the bag, holes in the bag and a poor seal none of which I have been able to replicate as a control.
My answer is that air would condense and contract when freezing and would return to its original state when thawed. How can liquid nitrogen get into the bag when it doesn't come into contact with the liquid nitrogen?
Does anyone out there have any other theories as to what happens which might explain the expansion as the bag is thawed.
 
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If the bag expands when warmed, then something has changed from liquid (or solid) to the gas state during the warming process.

If you have access to a laboratory the gas content could be analyzed - there are many possible techniques such as mass spectroscopy, or a residual gas analyzer, etc.

Once you know the gas composition you can work on how it is entering the bags.
 
Hi Jimbowen1072,

If the bag or the seal is faulty, gaseous nitrogen, as well as any other gases present can and will seep into the vacuum bag while in storage, condensing on the inner walls and the overwrap. Once out of the storage, it evaporates inflating the bag.
 
Thank you for your responses. I think that seepage might be a possibility and conducting short experiments might not be long enough to pick this up. It might be that the LN2 is taking hours or possibly even days to seep into levels that cause expansion which is why I haven't been able to replicate the problem with short tests.
 

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