Vector Force - Supporting Vs. Hanging

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the application of vector forces in the context of hanging loads and their inversion in a support system. Participants explore the mechanics of force distribution when a load is supported by two arms at an angle, comparing it to a hanging system.

Discussion Character

  • Technical explanation, Conceptual clarification, Debate/contested

Main Points Raised

  • One participant describes a scenario involving a weighted object anchored from two points and questions whether the same vector forces apply when the system is inverted, with a single base and two support arms.
  • Another participant confirms that the principles of vector forces are applicable in both configurations, though the free body vector diagram differs from the original setup.
  • A third participant agrees with the initial inquiry, suggesting that while practical examples may vary, the underlying principles remain consistent. They reference the work of architect Gaudi, who used inverted models to explore similar concepts.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants generally agree that the principles of vector forces apply in both hanging and inverted support systems, though there is some nuance regarding the practical implementation of these concepts.

Contextual Notes

There may be limitations in the practical application of these principles, as real-world scenarios may not perfectly mirror theoretical models. The discussion does not resolve specific mathematical details or assumptions regarding force calculations.

greg333
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I have only a very basic understanding of vector forces in the context of hanging loads - for example, a weighted object anchored from two points, the internal angle between the two lines from those points to the load determining the actual force each line must support.

What I don't know is if the same vector forces apply if you essentially invert that system - that is, a single base with two support arms leaving it at an angle and supporting a single load (e.g. a barbell held overhead with a wide grip).

In a typical snatch-width grip, a lifter will have about a 75-degree angle between the arms. If this were a hanging system, this would mean each arm were supporting about 63% of the weight. Does this hold true in the opposite direction?

Thanks!
 
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Yes.
The free body vector diagram is not the same as the original diagram turned upside down. But the features relevant to your specific question are the same.
 
greg333 said:
What I don't know is if the same vector forces apply if you essentially invert that system
As far as I can see, the answer to your question is Yes. It may be difficult to produce two situations in practice that are clearly mirror images of each other but it's right in principle.

You may be interested to see what this link has to say about the idea. The Spanish architect Gaudi created a number of architectural designs for systems of arches, by making 'upside down' models, using chains with weights hanging on them. There are many examples of his work to be seen in Barcelona and there is a museum which shows models of his technique. nSo the idea certainly has legs.
 
Thank you!
 

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