- #141
Anttech
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Well I guess they just didn't have their way then.
We will just go round in circles again with this one Yonzo, anyway, just wanted to touch on this point...
Neither did Israel ;)
Well I guess they just didn't have their way then.
Right. I guess those burnt humvees on the Israeli side of the UN recognised border were just moved there, with all the scorch marks and all.Anttech said:Depends which media you read really, there is a lot of evidence that states that Hezbollah captured the soliders in Lebanon!
Um, guess what happened just a little over a year ago? Israel left Gaza. Yeah, the soldiers were attacked beyond the 1947 cease fire line. Unless the Hindustan Times says otherwise, of course - maybe they know something we don't.Anttech said:Israel also seem to use the word kidnap, when their soliders go missing in Gaza...
Nope facts and figures...Speculation and opinion, was it?
I'll let you get away with that one.Anttech said:Neither did Israel ;)
Wonderful facts: it's good to know we were "saved" by a force that doesn't yet exist. I understand it's your opinion Israel should have kept up the assault.Anttech said:Nope facts and figures...
"We will not stop till we disarm hezbollah"
"We will not stop till we get our soliders back"
1500 dead people later, back in the same place as you were to begin with, actually rather a weaker place, but you are saved by that "enemy" of Israel the UN and those "Anti-sematic" Europeans leading it from the front .. (I can also be sarcastic)
No, what would happen is that Hizbullah will be encouraged to act more aggressively and other organisations will quickly adopt their model. The events will repeat themselves ad nauseum, as they have since the last time that route was taken with Hizbullah.Anttech said:Over reaction to the Nth degree... If you had just exchanged the prisoners, you wouldn't have been shelled (Neither would Lebanon have been), 1000 of Men Woman and Children would still be alive, and your PM wouldn't be praying the UN will deliever
Anttech said:Depends which media you read really, there is a lot of evidence that states that Hezbollah captured the soliders in Lebanon!
http://www.whatreallyhappened.com/israeli_solders.html
Israel also seem to use the word kidnap, when their soliders go missing in Gaza...
Anyway regardless of where it happened, what we do know is Hezbollah clashed with Israeli forces, then the 2 IDF soliders were taken prisoner
I recommend reading Iran's response to the resolution which Schrodinger's Dog mentioned previously, that should help answer your questions.russ_watters said:Explain, please.
Please provide the link, we cannot go hunting this down.kyleb said:I recommend reading Iran's response to the resolution which Schrodinger's Dog mentioned previously, that should help answer your questions.
Perhaps you missed the fact that the IAEA discovered two different grades of HEU in Iran? Also, you must have missed the humint reports I quoted. All this in addition to the dozen odd points of circumstantial evidence.kyleb said:I'm still getting the impression that you don't know of any evidence of Iran pursuing any weapons-only nuclear technology though.
Astronuc said:One could simply wait.
Ahmadinejad could actually be sincere about peaceful uses for enrichment.
I think I can explain myself better, so let me respond to this again.Lisa! said:Do you think they're crazy enough to start aa nuclear war
After 11 pages of posts, you do need to post the link or at the very least refer to the post number. First of all, not all members are following this thread that closely, and as for me, do you have any idea how many threads I am following? I don't have time to hunt to make sure I am looking at what you are referring to. That's why we have guidelines.kyleb said:The link is in the first post, he even quoted a bit from the Iran's response in post #8, assuming we are all reading the same thread here anyway. :uhh:
Mickey said:You didn't know? He believes that we're in the end times.
Bystander said:From #62,
Quote:
Originally Posted by edward
The president of Iran does appear to be a bit crazy, at least to westerners. But that does not mean that he is crazy enough to bring about his own incineration.(snip)
and, from #3,
Quote:
Originally Posted by cyrusabdollahi
Iran has 53,000 suicide bombers on stand by.
and, from WHO, http://www.who.int/mental_health/pre.../en/index.html ,
suicide rates run 20-30 per hundred thousand for males 15-34 years of age.
Crazy enough? Arguably crazier than "the average bear."
If only we could isolate them together, off the planet preferably...edward said:Ironically that is exactly what the U.S. Christian right believes. And they also believe it to the point that the are perfectly willing to try to make it happen.
Evo said:If only we could isolate them together, off the planet preferably...
I did note the HEU, but that has constructive uses as well. And can make weapons out of some pretty low grade stuff, no level of enrichment is exclusively for weapons and circumstantial evidence certainly not proof. Granted I wasn't expecting anything more than that though as if there was something substantial then surely the White House would be singing it from the rooftops rather than putting pressure on our intelligence community to come up with something.Gokul43201 said:Perhaps you missed the fact that the IAEA discovered two different grades of HEU in Iran? Also, you must have missed the humint reports I quoted. All this in addition to the dozen odd points of circumstantial evidence.
What would you consider evidence of a weapons grade enrichment program?
TuviaDaCat said:hizbulla made tunnels to go under our defences around gaza, and abducted the solider...
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/shared/spl/hi/middle_east/04/gazas_tunnels/html/7.stm"Anttech said:Have you got proof of that? I would Like pictures of these tunnel under gaza into Israel that Hezbollah built?
I would also be interested in how Hezbollah got to Gaza? via Jordan and Eygpt? Did they then built a big tunnel from Egypt under Gaza all the way through Israel to the northern border with Lebanon? That would be a very big tunnel.
Obviously, a Palestinian can dig a tunnel just as well as a Hizbullah man. These tunnels have been a feature of Gaza for quite some time, they probably are not Hizbullah's innovation, but the characteristics of the kidnapping, and the fact that it was controlled by Hamas' Syrian leadership, are the best available information that Hizbullah has its hand in this. It may well be a Hamas operation, but clearly Hizbullah is making it easier, and probably actively aiding, Hamas' struggle.Anttech said:Still in the link you provided I see information on Arms that Hezbollah has, but nothing on them "Helping" Palestine Soliders, dig the tunnels.
Glad we cleared that up.These tunnels have been a feature of Gaza for quite some time, they probably are not Hizbullah's innovation, but the characteristics of the kidnapping, and the fact that it was controlled by Hamas' Syrian leadership, are the best available information that Hizbullah has its hand in this.
hizbulla made tunnels to go under our defences around gaza, and abducted the solider...
There is an enrichment level below which nuclear warhead would be impractical to deliver or to form into a supercritical mass. The issue with HEU in Iran is that it indicates that the producers were going well beyond an enrichment necessary for power generation, which would contradict that the purposes would be for power generation. On the other hand, small research reactors and fast reactors use enrichments greater than 5% U-235, which is the current limit for LWR fuel. Nevertheless, higher enrichments make other people nervous.kyleb said:I did note the HEU, but that has constructive uses as well. And can make weapons out of some pretty low grade stuff, no level of enrichment is exclusively for weapons and circumstantial evidence certainly not proof.
Politics and World Affairs Guidelineskyleb said:And Evo, what guideline are you citing here?
2) Citations of sources for any factual claims (primary sources should be used whenever possible).
3) Any counter-arguments to statements already made must clearly state the point on which there is disagreement, the reason(s) why a different view is held, and cite appropriate sources to counter the argument.
cyrusabdollahi said:Also, Iran is a nation. Just as is Germany, or France, or Israel. They have every right to pursue nuclear technology if they want to. Other countries do not need to get our approval to govern themselves. Is this really what we want our nation to be known as? A bully that goes around meddling in everyones affairs?,,,,, and wake up one morning as we did on 911Ok let's say we don't meddle in there afairs and we wake up 1 morning and switch on the news and find out israel and some mager citys in the us have been wiped of the map, don't deseave yourself and think it won't happen after all 911 happened,this guy personaly beleives he's doing gods will by bringing armeggedon to the world and he said himself a presense came on him in a speech if that happened he must beleave in ala and he must fear going to the fires of hell if he doesn't do it,we should bomb the nuclear sights because they are not in civilian areas.
Such as what? Nuclear submarines and Fast Neutron Source Reactors - niether of which Iran possesses? And for the second time, you've ignored the humint reports. And you've failed to specify what would qualify as "substantial" evidence.kyleb said:I did note the HEU, but that has constructive uses as well.
This is irrelevant.And can make weapons out of some pretty low grade stuff,
It is evidence and evidence is what you asked for. Every time your request is met, you simply change it! First you changed the content of the "claim", and now you change the nature of the "evidence". What a waste of my time!no level of enrichment is exclusively for weapons and circumstantial evidence certainly not proof.
bartman fartman said:Ok let's say we don't meddle in there afairs and we wake up 1 morning and switch on the news and find out israel and some mager citys in the us have been wiped of the map, don't deseave yourself and think it won't happen after all 911 happened,this guy personaly beleives he's doing gods will by bringing armeggedon to the world and he said himself a presense came on him in a speech if that happened he must beleave in ala and he must fear going to the fires of hell if he doesn't do it,we should bomb the nuclear sights because they are not in civilian areas.
He said he wants to wype israel of the map, he said he wants to go bulk with nuclear weapons, he said he wants to defeat the anglo saxons, he kicked the u.n inspecters out, nobody took hitler serious at 1start and look what happened ,so the question is do we take this guy seriously,that guy who keeps disagreeing with everything you say will probally only realize the seriousnes of this if someone gets nuked.[/QUOTE]bartman fartman said:It is evidence and evidence is what you asked for. Every time your request is met, you simply change it! First you changed the content of the "claim", and now you change the nature of the "evidence". What a waste of my time!--------------------------------------------------------
I prefer you clarify something for me before I reply to this part of your post: what do you exactly in your mind by that "treating woemn harshly"?Gokul43201 said:I think I can understand why women would want to vote for him - from what I've read, he's been quite supportive of reform that treats women less harshly than before (and I hope that's what the majority of women want). I have no idea however, what percentage of the voting public is female; I've imagined this fraction to be small, but I hope I'm wrong. And I'm sure his strongly anti-American agenda resonated with a lot of people, but this is mostly second-hand information and some speculation. Also, maybe I'm just terribly disappointed because I always thought Karroubi had a good chance, and I was rooting for him (didn't care for either Ahmadinejad or Rafsanjani).
In people's nightmares!:tongue:Anttech said:I don't remember seeing Him say "He wants to beat the Anglo-Saxons" Nor that he want "to go bulk with Nuclear weapons"
Can you point me to where he said this?
I think its good if they have nuclear power shiped to them instead of developeing it themselfs i got no problem with them having nuclear power this way,We should investergate if they are building nuclear weapons after all we would do the same if it was russia saying these things and building these facilitys or if it was germany, anybody that thinks egnoring iran is the right thing to do needs to gro a brain.cyrusabdollahi said:This is nothing but what if...and what if tomorrow he converts and becomes a jew? I don't care much for what if. Do you have an ounce of proof that this plot is going to happen, or are you just fear mongering? This is nothing but a disparate argument.
You probably know stuff he said that i don't know and i know stuff he said that you probably don't know about, look it up on some credible web sights I am sure youl find it dude.Anttech said:I don't remember seeing Him say "He wants to beat the Anglo-Saxons" Nor that he want "to go bulk with Nuclear weapons"
Can you point me to where he said this?
I understand that, I just don't consider it reasonable to perpetuate such anxiety.Astronuc said:There is an enrichment level below which nuclear warhead would be impractical to deliver or to form into a supercritical mass. The issue with HEU in Iran is that it indicates that the producers were going well beyond an enrichment necessary for power generation, which would contradict that the purposes would be for power generation. On the other hand, small research reactors and fast reactors use enrichments greater than 5% U-235, which is the current limit for LWR fuel. Nevertheless, higher enrichments make other people nervous.
I have read those guidelines, but I made no factual claims or counter-arguments in the post I was reprimanded for, so what guideline have I broke? Is my crime here simply that I didn't bother to flip back to the beginning of the thread to copy the link which anyone who is actually interested in paying attention to this thread should know is there?*Edit* - And considering the prior events in this thread mentioned bellow, I'm curious; does making a factual claim while citing a source that doesn't back the claim go against our guidelines, or is that acceptable behavior here?Astronuc said:Politics and World Affairs Guidelines
https://www.physicsforums.com/showthread.php?t=113181
One is supposed to read and accept the guidelines in order to participate in the forums.
I'm sorry man, but I simply asked Yonoz to quote the portion of the article he was suggesting showed the evidence he claimed it did, and you took it on yourself to abstract from that. I tried to humor you hoping to learn something interesting, but most of what you presented I was already aware of and I've still yet to have my question answered. As far as I'm concerned this whole tangent has been a waste of time, so perhaps we should just leave it at that.Gokul43201 said:What a waste of my time!