What is the Derivative of x / (2 - tan x)?

  • Thread starter Thread starter communitycoll
  • Start date Start date
  • Tags Tags
    Derivative Tan
Click For Summary

Homework Help Overview

The discussion revolves around finding the derivative of the function x / (2 - tan x), with participants exploring various interpretations of the derivative and its simplifications.

Discussion Character

  • Mathematical reasoning, Assumption checking

Approaches and Questions Raised

  • Participants attempt to understand the derivative as computed by Wolfram Alpha and express confusion over the simplifications involved. There are questions about the signs in the denominator and the possibility of factoring terms.

Discussion Status

The discussion is ongoing, with participants providing insights and questioning each other's reasoning. Some guidance is offered regarding the handling of terms in the numerator and denominator, but no consensus has been reached on the simplifications.

Contextual Notes

There are references to the use of Wolfram Alpha for derivative calculations, and participants express uncertainty about the conventions used in the output. The discussion also highlights the complexity of algebraic manipulation in the context of derivatives.

communitycoll
Messages
45
Reaction score
0

Homework Statement


I need to find the derivative of x / (2 - tan x).


Homework Equations


I do everything Wolfram Alpha does here:
http://www.wolframalpha.com/input/?i=derivative+x+/+(2+-+tan+x)
Except I don't understand why the answer is (2+x sec^2(x)-tan(x))/(-2+tan(x))^2.

I get (x sec^2 x) / (2 - tan x).


The Attempt at a Solution


The solution above. Again just what Wolfram Alpha does, but I simplify:

(2+x sec^2(x)-tan(x))/(tan(x) - 2)^2

to

(x sec^2 x) / (2 - tan x).
 
Physics news on Phys.org
You can't pull a 2-tan(x) out of the top of that equation, there is a 2-tan(x) on the top as well as the bottom but on the top it's being added to the xsec^2(x) not multiplied so you can't simplify.
 
Vorde said:
You can't pull a 2-tan(x) out of the top of that equation, there is a 2-tan(x) on the top as well as the bottom but on the top it's being added to the xsec^2(x) not multiplied so you can't simplify.

Why is the tan x positive and the 2 negative in the denominator?

[Edit] Also can't I pull 2-tan(x) out of 1(2-tan(x)) and then just leave a 1 + x sec^2(x) up there in the numerator? [Edit]
 
I don't know why wolfram alpha changes the denominator, it has to be convention within wolfram alpha because there is no need for it. As for the numerator, it has to do with keeping track of parentheses with regards to negative signs, if you work it out it will make sense.

As for the second comment. No, because that would require dividing 2-tan(x) out of xsec^2(x) as well, which would only make it more confusing.
 
communitycoll said:

Homework Statement


I need to find the derivative of x / (2 - tan x).

Homework Equations


I do everything Wolfram Alpha does here:
http://www.wolframalpha.com/input/?i=derivative+x+/+(2+-+tan+x)
Except I don't understand why the answer is (2+x sec^2(x)-tan(x))/(-2+tan(x))^2.

I get (x sec^2 x) / (2 - tan x).

The Attempt at a Solution


The solution above. Again just what Wolfram Alpha does, but I simplify:

(2+x sec^2(x)-tan(x))/(tan(x) - 2)^2

to

(x sec^2 x) / (2 - tan x).
Algebra. Algebra. Algebra !

[itex]\displaystyle \frac{2+x \sec^2(x)-\tan(x)}{(\tan(x) - 2)^2}[/itex]
[itex]\displaystyle =\frac{2+x \sec^2(x)-\tan(x)}{(2-\tan(x))^2}[/itex]

[itex]\displaystyle =\frac{2-\tan(x)+x \sec^2(x)}{(2-\tan(x))^2}[/itex]

[itex]\displaystyle =\frac{2-\tan(x)}{(2-\tan(x))^2}+<br /> \frac{+x \sec^2(x)}{(2-\tan(x))^2}[/itex]

[itex]\displaystyle =\frac{1}{2-\tan(x)}+\frac{x \sec^2(x)}{(2-\tan(x))^2}[/itex]​
This is not simpler than what we started with.
 
Okay then thanks. I appreciate it.
 

Similar threads

  • · Replies 5 ·
Replies
5
Views
3K
  • · Replies 10 ·
Replies
10
Views
2K
  • · Replies 2 ·
Replies
2
Views
2K
  • · Replies 3 ·
Replies
3
Views
2K
  • · Replies 1 ·
Replies
1
Views
10K
  • · Replies 3 ·
Replies
3
Views
2K
  • · Replies 2 ·
Replies
2
Views
3K
  • · Replies 3 ·
Replies
3
Views
3K
  • · Replies 5 ·
Replies
5
Views
1K
Replies
7
Views
3K