What is the formula for finding work in two dimensions?

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Homework Help Overview

The discussion revolves around calculating work done by a force in two dimensions as a particle moves along the x-axis. The force has both x and y components, and participants are exploring how to account for these in the context of the given displacement.

Discussion Character

  • Mixed

Approaches and Questions Raised

  • Participants are attempting to determine the work done by the force using only the x-component due to uncertainty about the y-axis movement. Questions arise regarding whether the particle is constrained to move only along the x-axis, leading to discussions about the implications of the force components and displacement.

Discussion Status

There is ongoing exploration of the problem, with some participants expressing confidence in their calculations while others seek clarification on the assumptions made regarding the motion and angle between force and displacement. Guidance has been offered to consider the vector nature of the problem and the relationship between force and displacement.

Contextual Notes

Participants note the lack of explicit information about the y-axis movement and question the implications of the problem statement, which only provides displacement along the x-axis. There are also reminders about the importance of clear thread titles to avoid confusion.

Edel Crine
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Homework Statement
A force F=Fx ı +Fy j with Fx =50N and Fy =12N is exerted on a particle as the particle moves along the x axis from x=1.0m to x=-5.0m.
(a) Determine the work done by the force on the particle.
(b) What is the angle be- tween the force and the particle’s displacement?
Relevant Equations
W=F*x
Since we don't know how far does it move in y-axis, I assumed that only x-component does work.
a) W=Fx*Δx = 50N*(-6m) = -300 J

b) Θ = arctan(12/50) = 13.5°

But, I'm not sure that did I do this in right way...h
 
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Edel Crine said:
... as the particle moves along the x-axis from x=1.0m to x=-5.0m.
To clarify (in my mind,) is the particle constrained to "... move along the x- axis"?

because

"Since we don't know how far does it move in y-axis"
Well`, is the particle constrained or not?
 
lewando said:
To clarify (in my mind,) is the particle constrained to "... move along the x- axis"?

because

"Since we don't know how far does it move in y-axis"
Well`, is the particle constrained or not?
Ummm it gave us only the displacement of x-axis, but we know the two components of the force, so I'm not sure whether does it move in y-direction as well, but I think so...?
 
Edel Crine said:
Ummm it gave us only the displacement of x-axis, but we know the two components of the force, so I'm not sure whether does it move in y-direction as well, but I think so...?
I think you are right to suppose it is constrained by some other force(s), so the motion is only in the x axis.
But think about the angle again. Draw a diagram showing the directions of force and displacement vectors.
 
Edel Crine said:
Homework Statement:: A force F=Fx ı +Fy j with Fx =50N and Fy =12N is exerted on a particle as the particle moves along the x-axis from x=1.0m to x=-5.0m.
(a) Determine the work done by the force on the particle.
(b) What is the angle be- tween the force and the particle’s displacement?
Relevant Equations:: W=F*x

Since we don't know how far does it move in y-axis, I assumed that only x-component does work.
a) W=Fx*Δx = 50N*(-6m) = -300 J

b) Θ = arctan(12/50) = 13.5°

But, I'm not sure that did I do this in right way...h
My reading of the problem statement is that the particle literally moves along the x-axis. The y-coordinate there is zero. So its displacement has a y-component of zero.

By the way, I see that you used very nearly the same title for two threads you posted today. That's a bad idea.
 
SammyS said:
My reading of the problem statement is that the particle literally moves along the x-axis. The y-coordinate there is zero. So its displacement has a y-component of zero.

By the way, I see that you used the same title for two threads you posted today. That's a bad idea.
Oh yeah I did... 'Appreciate
 
SammyS said:
My reading of the problem statement is that the particle literally moves along the x-axis. The y-coordinate there is zero. So its displacement has a y-component of zero.

By the way, I see that you used very nearly the same title for two threads you posted today. That's a bad idea.
Then, I think I'm good for part a), but I'm not sure for part b)...
 
haruspex said:
I think you are right to suppose it is constrained by some other force(s), so the motion is only in the x axis.
But think about the angle again. Draw a diagram showing the directions of force and displacement vectors.
Ummm, would it be 0...?
 
Edel Crine said:
Ummm, would it be 0...?
Are you guessing now?

Did you follow @haruspex's suggestion?
 
  • #10
SammyS said:
Are you guessing now?

Did you follow @haruspex's suggestion?
I just used the x-component of the force and the displacement...
Let me try this again...
 
  • #11
Ummm I got 166°...?
 
  • #12
Edel Crine said:
Ummm I got 166°...?
Yes.
 
  • #13
haruspex said:
Yes.
Now, I see! I appreciate your help again...!
 
  • #14
Edel Crine said:
Homework Statement:: A force F=Fx ı +Fy j with Fx =50N and Fy =12N is exerted on a particle as the particle moves along the x-axis from x=1.0m to x=-5.0m.
(a) Determine the work done by the force on the particle.
(b) What is the angle be- tween the force and the particle’s displacement?
Relevant Equations:: W=F*x

Since we don't know how far does it move in y-axis, I assumed that only x-component does work.
a) W=Fx*Δx = 50N*(-6m) = -300 J

b) Θ = arctan(12/50) = 13.5°

But, I'm not sure that did I do this in right way...h
 

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  • #15
Bilbo B said:
(Image of a solution)
Your method for finding the work done is not effectively different from that in post #1.
For the angle, you have made the same mistake as in post #1.
 
  • #16
Hello Edel!
From the way you wrote your response to a, I think that you have got the correct result just because the displacement was negative. I might be wrong, though.

For a constant force and a finite displacement with a constant direction, the work is defined as ##W=\vec F\cdot\Delta\vec s##, where ##\vec F## is the vector of the force for which you want to find the work, and ##\Delta\vec s## is the displacement vector.

We have, then, that ##W=|\vec F||\Delta\vec s|\cos\theta=(|\vec F|\cos\theta)|\Delta\vec s|=\overline{F_{||}}\times|\Delta\vec s|##.
##\theta## is the smallest angle you can make between the two vectors; If you draw two segments starting from the same point, then, starting from one vector, you can either rotate right or left to reach the other one.
##\overline{F_{||}}## represents the "signed" force in the direction of the displacement, i.e it can be positive or negative, depending ##\cos\theta##. (one can also leave force as it is and think of the "signed" component of the displacement in the direction of force, and it is more useful when the displacement's direction is variable while that of the force is constant.)
If the angle between your force vector and your displacement vector is not in ##(-\frac{\pi}{2},\,\frac{\pi}{2})##, then ##\overline{F_{||}}\leq0##. It is ##0## if ##\theta## takes either ##\pi/2## or ##-\pi/2##, because ##\cos\pm\frac{\pi}{2}=0##.

Let's go back to your problem (she has already solved it, don't delete my comment mods):
Capture.PNG
$$\Delta\vec s=\vec x_f-\vec x_i=(-5.0-1.0)\hat\imath\\
\vec F=50\hat\imath+12\hat\jmath$$
You can see from the values of ##\vec F## that it points right from the up direction, and from the values of ##\Delta\vec s## that it points directly to the left direction. This tells us that the smallest angle between the two forces is obtuse, hence ##\overline{F_{||}}## is negative.
To calculate the work, just plug in the values: ##W=-|F_{||}||\Delta\vec s|=-1\times50\times6.0=-30.\times10^1\mathrm J##
To find the angle, also use the work formula, and I think that this was the aim of question b.
##W=|\vec F||\Delta\vec s|\cos\theta=-30.\times10^1##, thus ##\cos\theta=\frac{-30.\times10^1}{|\vec F||\Delta\vec s|}\Leftrightarrow\theta=\arccos\left(\frac{-30.\times10^1}{|\vec F||\Delta\vec s|}\right)\approx166.5^\circ\approx \left(17.\times10^1\right)^\circ##.
Sorry for the long post. 🤷‍♂️
For other usages, another definition of the dot product ##\vec u\cdot\vec v## is ##\left(u_xv_x+u_yv_y+u_zv_z+...\right)##. The ##+...## is for higher dimensions, you stop at what you have.
 
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