What is the Unit of Angular Acceleration in SI Units?

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the unit of angular acceleration in SI units, specifically whether it should be expressed as radians per second squared (rad/s²) or simply as 1/s². Participants explore the nature of radians as a unit and its implications in physics, touching on concepts of dimensionality and the treatment of angular measurements in equations.

Discussion Character

  • Debate/contested
  • Technical explanation
  • Conceptual clarification

Main Points Raised

  • Some participants assert that the unit of angular acceleration is rad/s², while others suggest it can be expressed as 1/s².
  • There is a contention regarding whether radians should be considered a physical unit, with some arguing they are dimensionless and others claiming they are indeed physical units.
  • One participant points out that radians are often omitted in calculations, suggesting they are not treated as dimensional units in practice.
  • Another participant argues that the treatment of radians as dimensionless does not negate their importance in equations involving angular measurements.
  • Some participants discuss the implications of treating angles as dimensionless in the context of nondimensionalization in physics.
  • A participant raises a question about the measurement of mass and its analogy to the measurement of angles, prompting further discussion on dimensionality.
  • There are references to specific equations, such as the relationship between angular speed and tangential speed, to illustrate points about units and dimensions.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants do not reach a consensus on whether radians should be classified as physical units. Multiple competing views remain regarding the dimensionality of radians and their treatment in physics.

Contextual Notes

The discussion highlights the ambiguity in the definitions of physical units and dimensions, as well as the conventions used in physics that may lead to confusion among students. The treatment of radians in various equations and contexts remains a point of contention.

  • #31
Pythagorean said:
If the NIST standard (see: The International System of Units: Physical Constants and Conversion Factors) for rad/s as a physical unit isn't enough, there's a more rigorous discourse here:

http://khimiya.org/volume14/radian_.pdf

But there's really nothing new there on top of what I've already said. It also highlights the important difference between "dimension" and "physical unit". If there's any confusion about the physical quantity being measured... it's called angle.

I read the article. I don't agree with its definition for rad. See for instance the second paragraph from the bottom of page 485 where it says

"sin(θ) clearly has no physical meaning. It should be remembered that θ and the unit rad are both physical quantities of the same kind. One must use the numerical value θ /rad as sin(θ / rad)".

If that were true than we would all have been very sloppy every time that we wrote the expression sin(θ) in our lives. That's a lot of sloppiness. Thankfully, it turns out that angles are adimensional quantities and the expression 1 rad = 1 isn't sloppy. True, angles are physical things but they happen to be adimensional physical things.
 
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  • #32
atyy said:
http://physics.nist.gov/cuu/Units/units.html

So looks like Pythagorean has a point. Radians is a way of multiplying by 1 (see Table 3). Indicating multiplication by 1 is optional but can aid in clarity (see Table 4).

I think your link shows that he doesn't have a point. 1 is not a unit.
 
  • #33
The unit is indeed dimensionless. Radian is dimensionless. If you try to evaluate the dimensions of angular acceleration, it is T^-2. So the units of angular acceleration being s^-2 makes sense.
 
  • #34
dauto said:
If that were true than we would all have been very sloppy every time that we wrote the expression sin(θ) in our lives.

Context is important. Rad as the ratio is a different interpretation than rads in a solid angle. The first is a formal mathematical definition, the second is a useful physical unit describing a quantity of solid angle. There's nothing wrong with carrying the rad in your sin(θ), there's just no reason to in pure mathematics (and of course, you absolutely should outside of mathematics... like in physics and engineering... where people use degrees and Hz).

dauto said:
True, angles are physical things but they happen to be adimensional physical things.

And that's exactly what I said. Obviously, it has no covering property (dimensionality) in cartesian space. r=0 is a point at the origin no matter how you vary theta. But we're not really talking about covering properties from the context of the OP, are we? That would be a diversion.

srijag said:
The unit is indeed dimensionless. Radian is dimensionless. If you try to evaluate the dimensions of angular acceleration, it is T^-2. So the units of angular acceleration being s^-2 makes sense.

The problem is more obvious comparing frequency to angular frequency. One has units of 1/s, the other has units of rad/s... and it is explicitly defined as such by NIST. This has nothing to do with dimensionality, really: it has to with their being a factor of 2*pi difference between the two units:

1= (1 rev)/(2*pi rad)

addendum: Note also that the NIST also explicitly defines angular acceleration with rads (atty's link, table 4) so, the OP's book violated the national standard.
 
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  • #35
It's interesting, isn't it? that we don't feel the need to give sines, cosines and tangents units, whereas we want to give units to angles, as measured by arc length/radius. Yet the trig ratios, and the angle, as measured by arc length/radius are all ratios of two lengths. If there were no other angle measure (for example, if nobody had ever thought of degrees), would anyone have wanted to stick a unit after an angle measured as arc length/radius?
 

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