Programs What Physics degree would be best for me?

[paisley666]

I like physics because of the formulas, explaining nature in terms of maths (I love math), I love problem solving and it's just so diverse. You learn about subjects from materials to astronomy it's just learning about how stuff works. So topics I like:
Kinematics
Any mechanics
Electricity
Materials
Astronomy
Fields
Nuclear Power
Generating power
a little bit of Engineering
Basically literally my whole a-level course BUT, particles and wave nature. I like concrete evidence and answers. I do not believe in the whole standard model thing. I don't really want to discuss this here I just want to know if I should still do physics, if I can avoid quantum mechanics and which degree would be best for me. E.G, Mathematical Physics, Theoretical or just plain Physics. And is it still really diverse at degree level like do you still do electricity??
Recently I've been thinking I just want to do a plain physics degree which would include a mixture of everything including lab work. I don't mind Labs. Which brings me to ask, what do you do in the lab at degree level physics?
Will I be able to avoid quantum mechanics? Hopefully it's just a small chunk of the degree. I'd also like to avoid relativity too.
I would be an engineer but I decided the context is actually quite boring. I don't want to build bridges and machines!

Thanks a lot :)

 

[composyte]

Do you plan on continuing physics into graduate school or just obtaining a bachelors degree? If it's the former, quantum mechanics and relativity will be your bread and butter, learn to love them. As for just obtaining your bachelors, you will need to do some quantum mechanics, but not a tremendous amount.

Also, from your post it seems you are dismissive of quantum mechanics because it lacks 'concrete evidence and answers'. Rest assured, the more you continue your education you will find this to be false.

 

[paisley666]

Just a bachelors degree.

Even so I just don't like it but i can put up with a bit.

 

[Student100]

Just a bachelors degree.

Even so I just don't like it but i can put up with a bit.

Your goal in physics should never be a terminal bachelors degree. In that case you're much better off studying engineering.

As far as a distaste for QM, you probably don't have a clear picture of what the subject really entails yet.

 

[Vanadium 50]

do not believe in the whole standard model thing. I don't really want to discuss this here I just want to know if I should still do physics, if I can avoid quantum mechanics and which degree would be best for me. E.G, Mathematical Physics, Theoretical or just plain Physics.

Dismissing something without knowing anything about it (and something whose discovery produced ~30 Nobel prizes) suggests that you would be a really poor scientist. Apart from the fact that you can't avoid quantum mechanics, this indicates physics - or science in general - would be a very poor choice for you.

I would be an engineer but I decided the context is actually quite boring. I don't want to build bridges and machines!

That crosses off engineering.

With science and engineering gone, you might want to think about humanities.

 

[micromass]

This is an important thing though. Do you not want to do quantum mechanics/relativity/standard model issues because you think they are incorrect, or merely because you think you don't like them?

 

[paisley666]

Oh for god sake I said I didn't want to talk about this HERE. Well thanks for your help guys (!)

 

[paisley666]

Pathetic. Can't even get a simple answer to a simple question.

 

[micromass]

Oh for god sake I said I didn't want to talk about this HERE. Well thanks for your help guys (!)

But it's important. Quantum mechanics and relativity are a huge part of any physics degree. So finding out why you want to avoid those is important.

 

[micromass]

Pathetic. Can't even get a simple answer to a simple question.

LOL

 

[paisley666]

But it's important. Quantum mechanics and relativity are a huge part of any physics degree. So finding out why you want to avoid those is important.

I'm not interested in it. I'd obviously like to do more of what I like and less of what I don't like so I just wanted to know what degree entails my interests.

 

[micromass]

I'm not interested in it. I'd obviously like to do more of what I like and less of what I don't like so I just wanted to know what degree entails my interests.

OK, you're not interested in it. But how did you assess that? What do you already know of quantum mechanics? I find it hard to believe a high school student can from an accurate opinion of what quantum mechanics is like!

 

[paisley666]

OK, you're not interested in it. But how did you assess that? What do you already know of quantum mechanics? I find it hard to believe a high school student can from an accurate opinion of what quantum mechanics is like!

How about I don't want to learn about particles? I mean some physicists don't like electricity so what's the problem if I don't like particular topics?

 

[paisley666]

Is this what the people in my physics degree are going to be like. I might just do maths.

 

[micromass]

How about I don't want to learn about particles? I mean some physicists don't like electricity so what's the problem if I don't like particular topics?

Sure, some physicists don't like electricity. But they still damn know it well. You can be a physicist and dislike a topic, but that is different from actively avoiding the topic and not wanting to learn it at all!

And again, how do you know you don't like a topic?

Is this what the people in my physics degree are going to be like. I might just do maths.

Good luck with that attitude! "Hey professor, I don't really like real analysis, so I want to skip it"

 

[paisley666]

Sure, some physicists don't like electricity. But they still damn know it well. You can be a physicist and dislike a topic, but that is different from actively avoiding the topic and not wanting to learn it at all!

And again, how do you know you don't like a topic?
Good luck with that attitude! "Hey professor, I don't really like real analysis, so I want to skip it"

What's the point, clearly doesn't seem like anyone really wants to help or I would've got an answer by now. All I need is "well for those topics the best degree would be..."
I give up.

 

[micromass]

What's the point, clearly doesn't seem like anyone really wants to help or I would've got an answer by now. All I need is "well for those topics the best degree would be..."
I give up.

The problem is that there is no degree satisfying the constraints you just put in.

 

[paisley666]

The problem is that there is no degree satisfying the constraints you just put in.

Okay thanks. Some piece of information that actually helps. But I guess it's true, I should put up a bit with stuff I don't like

 

[Vanadium 50]

Pathetic. Can't even get a simple answer to a simple question.

Here's the thing. You did get an answer to your question. You might not like the answer, but that doesn't mean you didn't get one. And the answer is that you can't get a degree in physics without learning QM. You also can't get a degree in engineering without learning about structures and machines, and you can't get a degree at all without having to learn something somewhere that you won't like.

 

[paisley666]

Here's the thing. You did get an answer to your question. You might not like the answer, but that doesn't mean you didn't get one. And the answer is that you can't get a degree in physics without learning QM. You also can't get a degree in engineering without learning about structures and machines, and you can't get a degree at all without having to learn something somewhere that you won't like.

Well actually that wasn't the answer I got the first time "go do humanities"

I guess I missed out a bit of information. I'll put up with it if it's a small part of the course, that's fine. But all I was saying is based on my likes and guess what DISLIKES because that's part of being human, which degree from all the varieties out there would be best for me. You just got all defensive about particle physics. Again I mentioned this in the beginning, I didn't want to discuss this here. If you want to talk about it I think you can private message on this site?

 

[micromass]

If you didn't want to talk about it, then don't bring it up. What did you expect? You said you didn't "believe" in a very successful physics theory. What do you think people would answer? What would you answer if somebody wanted to be a doctor and didn't "believe" that bacteria causes diseases.

Anyway, quantum mechanics is a very important part of physics, and so is relativity. I guess if you only want a bachelors, then you can avoid a lot of QM, although you won't be able to avoid it entirely. A bachelors in physics is completely useless though. If you want to do something with your degree, you'll need to go further than a bachelors. And yeah, then QM will play a much bigger role.

 

[micromass]

And really, if you're willing to dismiss an important part of physics without knowing anything about it, then "go do humanities" would be a good answer. I would actually advise you not to go to university at all if you're that closed minded.

 

[symbolipoint]

Well actually that wasn't the answer I got the first time "go do humanities"

I guess I missed out a bit of information. I'll put up with it if it's a small part of the course, that's fine. But all I was saying is based on my likes and guess what DISLIKES because that's part of being human, which degree from all the varieties out there would be best for me. You just got all defensive about particle physics. Again I mentioned this in the beginning, I didn't want to discuss this here. If you want to talk about it I think you can private message on this site?

Private-message discussion might be good IF ANYONE is willing to do this with you. Other important task for you is to see an advisor at your college or university, or prospective college or university.

 

[marcusl]

Go into EE. RF engineers are in demand, and you can use your E&M knowledge. Or if you like math, go into communications--lots of information theory, error correction coding, etc.

 

[paisley666]

If you didn't want to talk about it, then don't bring it up. What did you expect? You said you didn't "believe" in a very successful physics theory. What do you think people would answer? What would you answer if somebody wanted to be a doctor and didn't "believe" that bacteria causes diseases.

.

I know I regret it. I would edit it out but it's too late. I was thinking of doing a masters in maths or engineering but that's about it. Maybe everyone should keep an open mind because you never know. I read a book called The Higgs Fake by Alexander Unzicker.

Yep more hate messages to come. Who cares.

 

[paisley666]

Private-message discussion might be good IF ANYONE is willing to do this with you. Other important task for you is to see an advisor at your college or university, or prospective college or university.

I'll try the career advisor but usually they are useless and I'll attend an open day

 

[symbolipoint]

Private-message discussion might be good IF ANYONE is willing to do this with you. Other important task for you is to see an advisor at your college or university, or prospective college or university.

I'll try the career advisor but usually they are useless and I'll attend an open day

I say, more clearly, see an advisor IN THE ENGINEERING AND THE PHYSICS DEPARTMENTS at the prospective college or university, and NOT simply rely on the counselors in the admissions and records offices.

 

[paisley666]

I say, more clearly, see an advisor IN THE ENGINEERING AND THE PHYSICS DEPARTMENTS at the prospective college or university, and NOT simply rely on the counselors in the admissions and records offices.

I have my physics teacher but even she's not got a degree in physics but in a university, okay I will do!

 

[micromass]

I know I regret it. I would edit it out but it's too late. I was thinking of doing a masters in maths or engineering but that's about it. Maybe everyone should keep an open mind because you never know. I read a book called The Higgs Fake by Alexander Unzicker.

Yep more hate messages to come. Who cares.

Wow, I feel bad for you. You read the book by a very convincing crackpot, and you bought his ideas completely. Too bad you're willing to ignore one of the great successes of science based on what somebody else tells you, and not based on what you know about the field.
http://www.math.columbia.edu/~woit/wordpress/?p=6156

Science being a conspiracy is not a new idea. If you genuinely believe that, then you can also research creationism, the attacks on global warming and the anti-vaccine movement. There's a lot of material there, but they're all dead wrong. Sorry.

 

[symbolipoint]

Wow, I feel bad for you. You read the book by a very convincing crackpot, and you bought his ideas completely. Too bad you're willing to ignore one of the great successes of science based on what somebody else tells you, and not based on what you know about the field.
http://www.math.columbia.edu/~woit/wordpress/?p=6156

Science being a conspiracy is not a new idea. If you genuinely believe that, then you can also research creationism, the attacks on global warming and the anti-vaccine movement. There's a lot of material there, but they're all dead wrong. Sorry.

The forum member is still very young. Some of the member's misunderstandings and incorrect estimations may happen because of youth and immaturity. Much can change in the next three years.

 

[micromass]

The forum member is still very young. Some of the member's misunderstandings and incorrect estimations may happen because of youth and immaturity. Much can change in the next three years.

I understand, and I do hope so. I myself had quite some crankish ideas when I was in high school too. I remember I thought I calculated the (hyper)volume of the universe, or that I tried to invent a system where you can divide by zero and that would be better than what we have today. Those were fun times, but rather embarrassing nowadays.

I hope the OP does not get stuck on disbelieving one of the major successes of modern science based on crackpot's books alone. That would be sad. Really sad.

 

[Vanadium 50]

Yep more hate messages to come

Ever see Casablanca?

Ugarte: "You despise me, don't you?"
Rick: "If I gave you any thought, I probably would."

The unfortunate truth is that the OP wants something that doesn't exist - a physics degree that doesn't challenge his crackpot notions. The fact that he's using a device that uses quantum mechanics - a computer - to complain about quantum mechanics is deeply ironic.

 

[paisley666]

The forum member is still very young. Some of the member's misunderstandings and incorrect estimations may happen because of youth and immaturity. Much can change in the next three years.

You guys should write an essay disputing all of this crackpots claims and enlighten disenchanted souls like me. You clearly know the ins and outs of everything in this world. I admire you.

While you guys do that I will go find my career (probably in humanities because I will never be able to understand things great minds like yours can).

Take care x

 

[paisley666]

Ever see Casablanca?

Ugarte: "You despise me, don't you?"
Rick: "If I gave you any thought, I probably would."

The unfortunate truth is that the OP wants something that doesn't exist - a physics degree that doesn't challenge his crackpot notions. The fact that he's using a device that uses quantum mechanics - a computer - to complain about quantum mechanics is deeply ironic.

I am a girl btw. Just saying.

 

[micromass]

You guys should write an essay disputing all of this crackpots claims and enlighten disenchanted souls like me. You clearly know the ins and outs of everything in this world. I admire you.

Sorry, but that's not a good idea. It's like biologists debating with creationists: it gives a lot of weight to the creationist argument. And then it is presented in the media as "a conflict in science", while there is no conflict at all and all scientists agree. Furthermore, scientists are busy people and there are a lot of crackpots.

probably in humanities because I will never be able to understand things great minds like yours can

That's just not true. You just can't dismiss a field that you haven't studied rigorously yet. If you do that, then you shouldn't study science. If you keep an open mind and actually study the thing in question as opposed to listening to the first guy who catches your attention, then you should have a bright future in science.

 

[paisley666]

Sorry, but that's not a good idea. It's like biologists debating with creationists: it gives a lot of weight to the creationist argument. And then it is presented in the media as "a conflict in science", while there is no conflict at all and all scientists agree. Furthermore, scientists are busy people and there are a lot of crackpots.
That's just not true. You just can't dismiss a field that you haven't studied rigorously yet. If you do that, then you shouldn't study science. If you keep an open mind and actually study the thing in question as opposed to listening to the first guy who catches your attention, then you should have a bright future in science.

Ok thanks.

P.S. It was sarcasm.

 

[micromass]

P.S. It was sarcasm.

I knew lol.

 

[micromass]

I don't know why you need to be sarcastic about us knowing more than you though. We have studied science or mathematics for decades, while you're in high school and just read some popsci books. Of course we know more than you (in the field of science)! If you can't accept that and think that you should be taken as seriously as people studying these problems for years and years, then you're being delusional.

 

[nashed]

After reading this thread I figured the best option would be to post the syllabus of the standard physics degree in my university, bear in mind that I'm not from the USA but I don't think there'll be too much difference as the content of the bachelors degree is pretty much all standard stuff, so here's the actual list:

-Physics 1: this is an intro calculus based course, it covers Newtonian mechanics and the last 3 weeks ( about a fourth of the course) are about special relativity
-Physics 2: this is an intro to electromagnetic theory, it starts with the electric force of a stationary particle, introduces the concept of a field and develops Maxwell's equations, through out the course there is extensive use of special relativity because it is tied with electromagnetic phenomena from the field of a moving particle to the magnetic field and the fact that Maxwell's equations are Lorentz invariant, that is they work with Einstein's relativity not the classical relativity that you prefer.
-Analytical Mechanics: this course introduces a different formalism of classical mechanics in the form of the Lagrangian and Hamiltonian mechanics, both of which carry over to quantum mechanics in some form or another, I can't praise this course enough but content wise this is all you need to know about it.
-Waves: a course about waves and wave phenomena, I cannot elaborate more as I am a double major in EE and physics and we are not required to take this course
-Quantum mechanics 1: this is the intro course on quantum mechanics, it introduces the formalism and focuses on solving some standard problems as well as building some intuition
-Electromagnetism and Electrodynamics: a more advanced course on electromagnetism which also deals with moving particles, wave phenomena that result from that and what have you, uses special relativity in the latter parts.
-Thermodynamics and Statistical mechanics: so every course up till now focused on either introducing some framework of rules or on how to solve some problems that arise directly from these frameworks, but what happens when you want to deal with large systems with many particles? this course basically gives the framework that is used to deal with such problems, in the last two weeks or so it covers quantum systems as well, which are some of the more interesting systems to look at.
-Quantum mechanics 2: haven't taken it yet so I cannot comment, sorry.

and that basically does it for the required theoretical courses, and as you can see, every single one of them deals with either special relativity or quantum mechanics or both in same way shape or form (QM more so than SR really, but both are used frequently enough), armed with that knowledge you're free to decide wither or not you want to peruse a degree in physics.

Lastly and for completion's sake I will list the rest of the requirements for the degree on the off chance that those will sway you one way or another:
- about 7 courses of mathematics, mainly stuff dealing with analysis
- a single course in each of chemistry and programming
- about 4 or 5 labs, some of which require doing a project as well
-at least 3 out of 5 of: solid state physics, optics, physics of elementary particles, intro to biophysics and lastly astrophysics
- courses from a list of various topics until you complete the number of academic points required for the degree ( ranges from plasma physics to quantum information theory to chaos theory and quite a diverse list of topics)
-some gen ed courses

Whew, that took way longer than I expected but that is as thorough a review you"ll get for a physics degree, deciding if it suites you is entirely up to your judgement.

 

[Student100]

I know I regret it. I would edit it out but it's too late. I was thinking of doing a masters in maths or engineering but that's about it.

Again, if you don't plan on getting a doctorate in physics, an undergraduate degree in physics is not the best path.

Maybe everyone should keep an open mind because you never know. I read a book called The Higgs Fake by Alexander Unzicker.

Yep more hate messages to come. Who cares.

Pot calling the kettle black? There's a difference between having an open mind and rejecting something without knowing anything about it - which is what you're doing! Alexander Unzicker doesn't have a graduate degree in physics, doesn't work as physicist, and thus isn't qualified to talk about the things he writes in book.

 

[micromass]

and thus isn't qualified to talk about the things he writes in book.

And even if he were, it wouldn't make him right. And it wouldn't make the OP right for simply believing whatever he said. From Kip Thorne about errors in the Feynman lectures:

This second error was pointed out to Feynman by a number of readers, including Beulah Elizabeth Cox, a student at The College of William and Mary, who had relied on Feynman’s erroneous passage in an exam.To Ms. Cox, Feynman wrote in 1975, “Your instructor was right not to give you any points, for your answer was wrong, as he demonstrated using Gauss’s law.You should, in science, believe logic and arguments, carefully drawn, and not authorities.You also read the book correctly and understood it.I made a mistake, so the book is wrong.I probably was thinking of a grounded conducting sphere, or else of the fact that moving the charges around in different places inside does not affect things on the outside.I am not sure how I did it, but I goofed.And you goofed, too, for believing me.”

The OP seems smart. But if she refuses to follow the scientific process and rely on her own thought instead of parroting others, then she has no business in science!