- #1
Quix270
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I want to learn to design a synchronous generator, I search and search but I don’t find nothing to that.
What resources to learn to design a small 500W synchronous generator?
- Thread starter Quix270
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Discussion Overview
The discussion revolves around the design of a small 500W synchronous generator, with a focus on various types including those powered by water and using permanent magnets. Participants explore resources for learning about design, practical considerations, and the implications of connecting to the power grid.
Discussion Character
- Exploratory
- Technical explanation
- Debate/contested
- Homework-related
Main Points Raised
- One participant expresses a desire to learn how to design a synchronous generator but finds limited resources.
- Another participant questions the type of synchronous generator being discussed, specifically its connection to the grid.
- There is mention of the need to consider losses and other factors in the design process.
- Participants discuss the importance of consulting local power utilities regarding grid connection requirements, highlighting safety and operational concerns.
- Some participants suggest that synchronous generators are typically larger than 500W, with alternatives like DC generation being more practical for small-scale applications.
- One participant provides a link to a book on synchronous machine design, suggesting it could be a resource for learning.
- There is a discussion about the feasibility of using vehicle alternators for generating DC power instead of designing a synchronous generator from scratch.
- Several participants express a shared interest in DIY hydro power and the challenges associated with grid connection.
Areas of Agreement / Disagreement
Participants generally agree on the challenges of designing a synchronous generator and the practical considerations of connecting to the grid. However, multiple competing views exist regarding the best approach to generating 500W, with some advocating for synchronous generators and others suggesting alternatives like DC generation or vehicle alternators.
Contextual Notes
Participants mention various assumptions, such as the availability of a machine shop for fabrication and the specific power source for the generator. There are also unresolved questions about the requirements for connecting to the grid and the implications of safety regulations.
Who May Find This Useful
Individuals interested in DIY renewable energy projects, particularly those focused on small-scale hydro power and generator design, may find this discussion relevant.
- #2
berkeman
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Synchronous with what? The Grid? If so, are you planning some kind of combination to power your home with this generator and Grid power?
- #3
Quix270
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Yeah, synchronous with electro magnets conectes to the grid. Where I can learn to design that? Including losses and all factors I have to consider
- #4
berkeman
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I'll page @anorlunda to get you a better answer, but you will also need to talk to your local power utility to find out what-all you need to do in order to connect any power generation to the Grid. They control the specifications and approvals for the interface to the Grid, because there are several very important things to do right (or else people can get hurt). You can do a search on "Anti-Islanding" in power generation, for example to see one such very important requirement.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Islanding
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Islanding
- #5
Quix270
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And for permanent magnet synchronous generator? Where I can learn to design that?
- #6
berkeman
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Do you have access to a machine shop to do this fabrication?Quix270 said:
- #7
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In most cases, synchronous generators are much larger than 500W, like up to 1 GW.
But a quick search on Amazon, showed many books on syncrhnous machine design. For example, this one
https://www.amazon.com/dp/B00866H3NM/?tag=pfamazon01-20
By the way, there is no essential difference between a synchronous generator and a synchronous motor.
But that info is not likely to help you. You are not allowed to connect your own generation directly to the power grid. That causes numerous safety problems and operations problems for the utility. In most places, the utility requires an interface box that they supply and they install. Most of those are designed for homeowners with solar DC or wind power at their homes. You could do the same, but the interface box makes the advantage of synchronous generators vanish. It may be better for you to generate 500W DC.
Small scale wind turbines tend to use BLDC generators. That would probably work better for you than synchronous.
I'm curious, what is your source of 500W of mechanical power? Is it hydro? If so, then many DIY hydro homowners just use vehicle alternators to generate the DC.
But a quick search on Amazon, showed many books on syncrhnous machine design. For example, this one
https://www.amazon.com/dp/B00866H3NM/?tag=pfamazon01-20
By the way, there is no essential difference between a synchronous generator and a synchronous motor.
But that info is not likely to help you. You are not allowed to connect your own generation directly to the power grid. That causes numerous safety problems and operations problems for the utility. In most places, the utility requires an interface box that they supply and they install. Most of those are designed for homeowners with solar DC or wind power at their homes. You could do the same, but the interface box makes the advantage of synchronous generators vanish. It may be better for you to generate 500W DC.
Small scale wind turbines tend to use BLDC generators. That would probably work better for you than synchronous.
I'm curious, what is your source of 500W of mechanical power? Is it hydro? If so, then many DIY hydro homowners just use vehicle alternators to generate the DC.
- #8
Quix270
- 32
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Yesberkeman said:
- #9
Quix270
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In case I want to design a 500w synchronous generator powered by water, where I can learn to design it? Permanent magnet
- #10
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I gave you a link in #7.Quix270 said:
Design from scratch can be very rewarding, but if the goal is something practical rather than the joy of designing your own, then there are easier ways.
But an ordinary 50 amp, 12 V alternator can make 500 watts DC for you. You can probably find one in a junkyard for $5 to $10. Also, inexpensive 12V inverters can make AC for you to run your appliences from that, but not to connect to the grid.
On Youtube you can find many DIY hydro videos showing how others have done that.
Good luck. I envy you. I would love to own some land where DIY hydro was practical.
- #11
Quix270
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So in the link you give I can lear to design a generator from 0? Thanks for you help
- #12
berkeman
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berkeman said:
Quix270 said:
Same here! I envy that he has land with enough hydro head to make some local power, and access to a machine shop to fabricate a generator. Very fun.anorlunda said:
I don't think I'd be wanting to jump through all the hoops to push 500W back into the Grid when I'm not using it, though.
- #13
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I always compared a small hydro plant to a machine that prints money. The original Niagara Falls generators continued producing for nearly 100 years, with just a few drops of oil per year maintenance.berkeman said:
We should both move to Norway. There is lots of unused land there, and 1000 m of head is not unusual. Just bore a hole in the rock from the glacier topped plateau, down to sea level and use a pelton wheel. That's a fun daydream.
- #14
Quix270
- 32
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You’re right