Why is c Squared in the Equation e=mc^2?

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Discussion Overview

The discussion centers on the equation e=mc^2, specifically exploring why the speed of light (c) is squared in this context. Participants engage in dimensional analysis, the relationship between mass and energy, and the implications of relativistic concepts, including discussions on particles that travel at or faster than the speed of light.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Technical explanation
  • Conceptual clarification
  • Debate/contested
  • Mathematical reasoning

Main Points Raised

  • One participant questions the necessity of squaring c in the equation e=mc^2, indicating a lack of understanding.
  • Another participant suggests using dimensional analysis to equate the units of energy with mass and the speed of light, leading to the conclusion that c must be squared.
  • A participant introduces the general form of energy dependence on mass and speed of light, proposing a dimensional analysis approach to derive the relationship.
  • Discussion includes the concept of momentum and its relation to mass and energy, with a participant arguing that mc has no physical meaning for tardyons, which do not travel at the speed of light.
  • Clarifications are made regarding the definitions of tardyons, luxons, and tachyons, with some participants correcting earlier statements about their properties and speeds.
  • One participant mentions that some authors consider the relationship p=mc applicable to luxons, indicating a potential divergence in understanding mass and momentum in relativistic contexts.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express varying interpretations of the concepts surrounding e=mc^2, with no consensus on the implications of mass, energy, and the definitions of particles traveling at different speeds. The discussion remains unresolved regarding the physical meaning of certain terms and relationships.

Contextual Notes

Limitations include potential misunderstandings of particle classifications (tardyon, luxon, tachyon) and the implications of dimensional analysis in deriving physical relationships. The discussion reflects a range of assumptions and definitions that are not universally agreed upon.

jhe1984
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In e=mc^2, why is c squared?

The (mc) isn't squared, right?

Please don't be insulted by the remedialness of this question: I simply don't know.

:frown:
 
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Try and get the units of the right hand side the same as the units of joules. Remember, a joule has the units of

[M L^2 T^{-2}].
 
Along the same line with masud, what's the expression for nonrelativistic KE ?

Daniel.
 
To explain the above responses a little: this is called dimensional analysis.

If you think energy E depends on mass m and the speed of light c, then how must those things be combined? The most general way is like this:

E = km^\alpha c^\beta

where \alpha and \beta are constants to be determined, and k is a dimensionless constant (a number without units).

Now, energy, in SI units, is in Joules, and 1 Joule is 1 kilogram (metre/second)^2. The dimensions of energy are therefore mass.(length/time)^2, often written: [M][L]^2[T]^{-2}.

Similarly, the dimensions of m are: mass, or [M]
The dimensions of c are: (length/time), or [L][T]^{-1}

Putting these dimensions into the general equation, we get:

[M][L]^2[T]^{-2} = k([M]^\alpha)([L]^\beta [T]^{-\beta})

We want to solve for alpha and beta. Matching the dimensions on the left and right hand sides gives:

[M]: \alpha = 1
[L]: \beta = 2
[T]: -\beta = -2

Therefore, our expression must be:

E = kmc^2

This doesn't tell us what k is. k could be 1 or 17 or pi, or some other number. To find k, we need to derive the equation from physical arguments. If we do that, we find that k=1.

However, this argument is enough to show you that the speed of light must be squared.
 
mc has the dimensions of momentum and has no physical meaning because a
tardyon never moves with speed c.
mcc has the dimensions of energy. the invariance of c makes that it transforms as mass does. avoiding the concept of mass. the concept of relativistic energy mcc and rest energy avoids the endless discussion concerning the use of the concept of relativistic mass.
 
The tardyon Mr. Rothenstein is referring to is a theoretical particle with imaginary (i) rest mass, and therefore travels faster than light.
 
A tardyon or bradyon is a particle that travels slower than light. This includes all known particles (except luxons). The term "tardyon" is constructed to contrast with "tachyon", which refers to hypothetical particles that travel faster than light.

Tardyons have positive masses, whereas luxons have zero mass.
(quoted from Wikipedia)
 
A tardyon or bradyon is a particle that travels slower than light. This includes all known particles (except luxons). The term "tardyon" is constructed to contrast with "tachyon", which refers to hypothetical particles that travel faster than light.

Tardyons have positive masses, whereas luxons have zero mass.
 
I apologize, I got them mixed up.

Tardyon speed < c
Luxon speed = c
Tachyon speed > c
 
  • #10
there are authors who consider that p=mc works in the case of a luxon (photon) p and m representing its momentum and mass repectively.
 

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