Why is convection heat transfer rate independent of relative velocity?

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the relationship between convection heat transfer rate and relative velocity, particularly in the context of Newton's cooling law. Participants explore theoretical and practical implications of convection in different flow regimes, examining how velocity may or may not influence heat transfer rates.

Discussion Character

  • Debate/contested
  • Technical explanation
  • Conceptual clarification

Main Points Raised

  • Some participants suggest that convection heat transfer rate, as described by Newton's cooling law, does not include a term for relative velocity between the fluid and the solid surface.
  • Others argue that in very fast convection scenarios, the fluid does not heat significantly, implying that heat transfer may not depend on velocity, while in slow convection, heat transfer is proportional to velocity.
  • A participant questions the assertion that heat transfer is independent of relative velocity, seeking clarification on the conditions under which convection might depend on velocity.
  • Another participant emphasizes that every law has limits of application, suggesting that using Newton's law in inappropriate conditions could lead to incorrect results.
  • One participant asserts that convection does depend on relative velocity, noting that variations in velocity affect the heat transfer coefficient, which is often treated as a constant in introductory courses.
  • Empirical formulas for heat transfer coefficients are mentioned, which relate to non-dimensional parameters like Reynolds number, indicating that relative flow velocity is a significant factor in certain contexts.
  • A later reply references a "king's law" that connects convection heat transfer coefficient to flow velocity, indicating further exploration of the topic.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express differing views on whether convection heat transfer is dependent on relative velocity, with some asserting it is independent while others argue it is dependent under certain conditions. The discussion remains unresolved with multiple competing perspectives.

Contextual Notes

Participants note that the applicability of Newton's cooling law may vary based on the convection speed, and the discussion highlights the importance of understanding the limits of theoretical models in practical scenarios.

indianaronald
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Convection heat transfer rate decided by Newton's cooling law doesn't have a relative velocity between the fluid and the solid surface term. But intuitively doesn't blowing faster on a hot surface make it cool quicker?
 
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If convection is very fast, the fluid will not heat much, so heat transfer does not depend on the velocity.

If convection is very slow, the fluid will reach the temperature of the object, and heat transfer is proportional to the velocity.

If convection is somewhere in between, the result is somewhere between those limits.
 
What do you mean 'heat transfer is proportional to velocity'. I thought it wasn't. I mean, so convection is dependent on relative velocity?
 
It depends on the convection speed, see my previous post.

Every law has limits of its application. If you try to use a law in a setup where the law does not hold, you should not be surprised if the result is wrong.
 
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Ok. That answers the question. Thanks.
 
Convection DOES depend on the relative velocity. In Newton's law of cooling, that variation changes the value of the heat transfer coefficient.

In a first physics or engineering course on heat transfer, you are oten given the heat transfer coefficient h as a constant value, so you can focus on solving the rest of the problem rather than figuring out what value of h to use.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Heat_transfer_coefficient has empirical formulas (i.e. derived from experiments, not purely from theory) for heat transfer coefficients for different situations. These are defined in terms of non-dimensional parameters like the Nusselt, Prandtl, Rayleigh and Reynolds numbers (and you can find definitions of what those quantities are in Wikipeida).

The main parameter that contains the "relative flow velocity" is Reynolds number, Re. The other parameters depend mainly on the fluids involved (e.g. whether the heat is convecting into air or water) and also vary a bit with temperature and pressure.
 
Thanks. Found out something about a king's law that relates convection heat transfer coefficient to flow velocity.
 

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