Why Is It Harder to Lift Someone When They Are Asleep?

  • Context: High School 
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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the perceived difficulty of lifting a person when they are asleep compared to when they are awake. Participants explore the concepts of weight, body mechanics, and the role of assistance and body rigidity in lifting scenarios. The scope includes conceptual reasoning and experimental ideas for a science fair project.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory, Conceptual clarification, Homework-related

Main Points Raised

  • One participant notes that the difference in lifting difficulty may be due to the assistance provided by the person when awake, such as adjusting their position and grip.
  • Another participant suggests that the center of gravity plays a crucial role, indicating that when the center of gravity is aligned closer to the lifter, it is easier to lift the person.
  • A different viewpoint emphasizes the rigidity of the body when asleep, which can make it harder to grip and maneuver effectively.
  • One participant proposes a practical demonstration using sacks of different materials to illustrate the concept of dead weight versus live weight.
  • There is a discussion about the importance of torque and moment arms in lifting, with a participant expressing uncertainty about how these concepts apply to the differences in lifting a sleeping versus awake person.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants generally agree that factors such as body rigidity, center of gravity, and assistance influence the difficulty of lifting someone. However, there is no consensus on a single explanation or experiment to demonstrate these ideas effectively.

Contextual Notes

Participants express uncertainty regarding the practical aspects of measuring weight and the application of torque and moment arms in their proposed experiments. There are also assumptions about the willingness of the subject to participate in the experiments.

Nickduh
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I am a 8th grade student getting ready for a science fair project. My sister, 80lbs, is impossible to lift when she is asleep. But I can pick her up when she is awake. What is the difference between dead weight ( asleep) and live weight? I know she has to weigh the same amount but why is she so much heavier when she's sleeping? Help.
 
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She helps you lift her when she is awake and hinders whe she is asleep. Awake, she might jump just a little so you don't have to lift so much weight and grab on your neck with both arms to reduce the torque. Asleep, her center of gravity is far from yours: gravity is not just exerting force on you but also torque.
 
Thanks DH. Now I have to think up an experiment to show how she seems to weigh so much more asleep. When I get the experiment clearer in my mind can I ask you what you think?
Nick
 
Even without her active assistance, the rigidity of the body makes a huge difference. Asleep, her mass is constantly shifting, which makes it very difficult to get a grip in a convenient location.
You can demonstrate this for yourself by taking a large sack of something like potatoes and an equal size/weight of boards or similar solid material. See which is easier to lift and manoeuvre.
 
It is entirely about center of gravity. If her center of gravity (roughly in her midsection) is close to you, she is easy to lift. If it isn't, she's impossible to lift without you falling over. Very important concept for wrestling, btw - if someone is trying to pick you up by grabbing you around the waist, just lean back into them with your hips away from them and it will simply be impossible.
 
Thanks Russ. What to you think would be a cool experiment to show this? I'm not sure she is going to let me weigh her awake or asleep? I'm looking at torque and moment arms but not sure how it works with this idea of dead weight vs. live weight. Just think the idea is cool cause it happens all the time with her.
 

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