Why is the work done by an ideal gas the area under a PV diagram?

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around understanding why the work done by an ideal gas is represented as the area under a pressure-volume (PV) diagram. Participants explore the physical interpretation of this relationship, comparing it to other graphical representations in physics.

Discussion Character

  • Conceptual clarification
  • Technical explanation
  • Exploratory

Main Points Raised

  • One participant asks for a physical proof of why the work done by a gas corresponds to the area under a PV diagram, acknowledging the relationship dW = P dV.
  • Another participant suggests that the relationship can be derived from the equations W = P x V and the definitions of force and area.
  • A participant expresses understanding of the equation but seeks a deeper physical explanation, comparing it to the area under a velocity-time graph representing displacement.
  • It is noted that the area under the PV graph represents the product of pressure and volume, which is equivalent to work done.
  • One participant emphasizes that pressure can be viewed as the amount of work done per unit volume change, suggesting a conceptual shift in understanding pressure.
  • A caution is raised regarding the assumption of quasistatic conditions when applying this relationship, prompting consideration of scenarios with differing internal and external pressures.
  • Another participant highlights the importance of dimensional analysis, showing that the units of pressure multiplied by volume yield energy units, reinforcing the connection to work done.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants generally agree on the mathematical relationship between work, pressure, and volume, but there is no consensus on the physical interpretation, particularly regarding conditions under which the relationship holds true.

Contextual Notes

Participants mention the assumption of quasistatic conditions and the implications of varying internal and external pressures, indicating that the discussion may not apply universally without further clarification.

goodcow
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Could someone please prove why the work done by a gas is the area under a PV diagram?

That is, I know that dW=P \text{ }dV, but why is that true physically? I realize that W=f \cdot d \text{ and } F=P \cdot A .Thanks.
 
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You have more or less done it for yourself!
W = P x V...P = F/A and V = A x d
W = F/A x A/d ...= F x d
 
Well yes, I know that the equation is true, but I was wondering why it's physically true. For example, the area under a velocity-time graph is displacement. Why is the area under the graph the work done?
 
It is because the graph is of P against V so the area under this graph must be the PxV quantity...which is Fxd = work done.
 
Oh...wow I'm silly. Thanks!
 
you are in good company!
 
Another way to say all this is that, you understand the area under the v vs. t curve is displacement x because you think of v as dx/dt. Thus, to understand why the area under a P vs. V curve is work done, you simply need to think of pressure as dW/dV, i.e., pressure is the amount of work done per unit volume change. In other words, instead of thinking of work as something that comes from pressure, think of pressure as a concept that stems directly from work. That is very much what pressure is-- the concept of the amount of work done per volume change. Indeed, there are situations where the easiest way to calculate pressure P is to first calculate the work W as a function of V and take dW/dV.
 
just remember that this is true under the assumption of quasistatic conditions, which is almost static but notquite.
think about a situation where the internal pressure is much higher than the external presssure. how do you calculate work then?

thafeera
 
Another little tip: look at the units of the quantities you are multiplying.
P x V units are Pa x m^3 = (N/m^2) x m^3 = Nm = energy units
v x t units are ms^-1 x s = m = distance units
F x e units N x m = energy units
V x Q units are volts x charge = V x C = (J/C) x C = J = energy units
 

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