Variable substitution in Langevin equation and Fokker-Planck equation

In summary, the conversation discusses the issue of variable substitution in the Langevin equation and Fokker-Planck equation. The problem arises when using a variable substitution of y(x), leading to different results in the stationary distribution. The potential cause of this discrepancy is attributed to the use of different interpretations of stochastic calculus, specifically the Stratonovich and Ito interpretations. The conversation ends with the suggestion to use the Ito calculus and the additional term it produces in order to properly account for multiplicative noise.
  • #1
Tianwu Zang
11
0
Dear all,
I have a question about the variable substitution in Langevin equation and Fokker-Planck equation and this has bothered me a lot. The general Langevin equation is:
$$\frac{dx}{dt}=u(x)+\sqrt{2 D(x)}\eta(t)$$
and the corresponding Fokker-Planck equation is thus:
$$\frac{\partial \rho(x)}{\partial t}=-\frac{\partial}{\partial x}\left[u(x)\rho(x)\right]+\frac{\partial^2}{\partial x^2}\left[D(x)\rho(x)\right]$$
which means the stationary distribution of x should satisfy
$$u(x)\rho(x)=\frac{\partial}{\partial x}\left[D(x)\rho(x)\right]$$
However, problem emerges when I want to use a variable substitution y(x), since the Langevin equation becomes
$$\frac{dy}{dt}=u(x)y'(x)+\sqrt{2 D(x)}y'(x)\eta(t)$$
which the corresponding F-P equation
$$\frac{\partial \rho(y)}{\partial t}=-\frac{\partial}{\partial y}\left[u(x)y'\rho(y)\right]+\frac{\partial^2}{\partial y^2}\left[D(x)y'^2\rho(y)\right]$$
and the stationary distribution of y is thus
$$u(x)y'\rho(y)=\frac{\partial}{\partial y}\left[D(x)y'^2\rho(y)\right]$$
Considering
$$\rho(x)dx=\rho(y)dy \Rightarrow \rho(x)=\rho(y)y'$$
we can rewrite the stationary ρ(y) equation before as
$$u(x)\rho(x)=\frac{\partial}{\partial y}\left[D(x)y'\rho(x)\right]=\frac{\partial}{\partial x}\left[D(x)y'\rho(x)\right]x'(y)=\frac{1}{y'}\frac{\partial}{\partial x}\left[D(x)y'\rho(x)\right]$$
which is not equal to the stationary ρ(x) derived before. Is there anything wrong with my derivation? Can anyone help me to figure this out? :frown::frown::frown::frown::frown::frown::frown:
I have posted the same question in classical physics forum a few days ago but not one replies me. I hope people here can show me where I am going wrong or why this result happens. Thanks so much! :smile::smile::smile:
 
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  • #2
You have to be careful when doing changes of variables in a stochastic differential equation. There are two main interpretations of stochastic calculus that physicists like to use: the Stratonovich interpretation and the Ito interpretation. The nature of your problem dictates which one to use, and things like changing variables are not the same in both (I'm afraid I don't remember the guidelines for which one you should use in which case). In Stratonovich, the change of variables follows the usual chain rule, while in Ito an additional term is produced. See http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ito_Calculus#It.C5.8D_calculus_for_physicists

I believe the distinction is very important when you have multiplicative noise, as you do in your equation. (Also, I have been told that the distinction is only important when you have delta-function or singular noise correlations. If the noise correlations are given by some smoothly decaying function C(t-t'), then apparently the distinction between the two interpretations is unimportant).

So, I think the problem may be that you should be using the Ito calculus and the additional term produced by the change of variables.
 
  • #3
Mute said:
You have to be careful when doing changes of variables in a stochastic differential equation. There are two main interpretations of stochastic calculus that physicists like to use: the Stratonovich interpretation and the Ito interpretation. The nature of your problem dictates which one to use, and things like changing variables are not the same in both (I'm afraid I don't remember the guidelines for which one you should use in which case). In Stratonovich, the change of variables follows the usual chain rule, while in Ito an additional term is produced. See http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ito_Calculus#It.C5.8D_calculus_for_physicists

I believe the distinction is very important when you have multiplicative noise, as you do in your equation. (Also, I have been told that the distinction is only important when you have delta-function or singular noise correlations. If the noise correlations are given by some smoothly decaying function C(t-t'), then apparently the distinction between the two interpretations is unimportant).

So, I think the problem may be that you should be using the Ito calculus and the additional term produced by the change of variables.

Yes I think you get the point. It seems that Ito calculus uses a different method for changing the variables. I am really unfamiliar with this area before so your link really helps. Thanks a lot!
 

1. What is variable substitution in the Langevin equation and Fokker-Planck equation?

Variable substitution refers to the process of replacing certain variables in the Langevin equation and Fokker-Planck equation with new variables. This is done in order to simplify the equations and make them easier to solve.

2. Why is variable substitution necessary in these equations?

The Langevin equation and Fokker-Planck equation are often used to describe the dynamics of complex systems, such as particles in a fluid. These equations involve multiple variables and can be difficult to solve directly. Variable substitution allows for the equations to be simplified and solved more easily.

3. How is variable substitution performed in these equations?

Variable substitution can be performed by replacing the original variables with new variables that are related to the original ones. This can involve using mathematical transformations or change of variables. The goal is to reduce the number of variables in the equations and make them easier to solve.

4. What are some common substitutions used in these equations?

Some common substitutions used in the Langevin equation and Fokker-Planck equation include using dimensionless variables, introducing new variables to account for symmetry or conservation laws, and transforming the equations into a new coordinate system. These substitutions can help to simplify the equations and make them more manageable to solve.

5. Are there any limitations to using variable substitution in these equations?

While variable substitution can be a useful tool in simplifying the Langevin equation and Fokker-Planck equation, it may not always be possible or appropriate. The choice of substitutions depends on the specific system being studied and the desired outcome. In some cases, certain substitutions may not lead to meaningful results or may introduce additional complications. Therefore, it is important to carefully consider the limitations and implications of variable substitution before applying it to these equations.

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