Postion -> Velocity -> Acceleration -> Jerk ->?

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the derivatives of position with respect to time, specifically exploring the fourth derivative (often referred to as "snap") and higher-order derivatives such as fifth and sixth derivatives. Participants are curious about their definitions, practical applications, and whether they are commonly used in physics or mathematics.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Technical explanation
  • Conceptual clarification
  • Debate/contested

Main Points Raised

  • One participant notes that the fourth derivative of position, x''''(t), is the derivative of jerk and suggests it may be referred to as "spasm," "jounce," "sprite," or "surge," with further derivatives humorously named "crackle" and "pop."
  • Another participant expresses curiosity about practical examples or graphs that could illustrate the fifth or sixth derivatives of position and questions their necessity.
  • A participant mentions that harmonic functions, such as the sine function, will have non-zero derivatives of all orders, implying that these higher derivatives are mathematically relevant.
  • It is suggested that derivatives of order four and five can be useful for finding and classifying maximum and minimum accelerations.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express curiosity and humor regarding the naming and utility of higher-order derivatives, but there is no consensus on their practical applications or necessity in real-world scenarios. Multiple viewpoints on the relevance of these derivatives are present.

Contextual Notes

The discussion does not resolve the practical applications of higher-order derivatives, and assumptions about their use in specific contexts remain unexamined.

Who May Find This Useful

This discussion may be of interest to those studying calculus, physics, or engineering, particularly in contexts involving motion and derivatives.

tectactoe
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We all know that, assuming x(t) = position as a function of time, then:

x'(t) = v(t) = velocity
x''(t) = v'(t) = a(t) = acceleration
x'''(t) = v''(t) = a'(t) = j(t) = jerk (assuming j is the symbol for jerk).

But what does x''''(t) = j'(t) come out to be? Is there a fourth derivative of position? And if so, is it ever practically used?

What about fifth, sixth, seventh, etc derivatives?

This is just something I've been extremely curious about since I learned of the third derivative, jerk (or jolt).

Thanks!
 
Physics news on Phys.org
The term ¨x¨[d4x/dt4 is the time derivative of the jerk,
which might be called a ‘‘spasm.’’ It has also been called a
‘‘jounce,’’ a ‘‘sprite,’’ a ‘‘surge,’’ or a ‘‘snap,’’ with its successive
derivatives, ‘‘crackle’’ and ‘‘pop.’’

http://sprott.physics.wisc.edu/pubs/paper229.pdf

'snap', 'crackle' and 'pop'...:smile:
 
Haha that's funny.

Does anyone happen to have a position/time graph in which you'd be able to calculate something like the fifth or sixth derivative of x? Would these ever even be needed? Hah.
 
Anything that is a harmonic function, like say a pendulum, will have a non zero nth order x^n derivative thing.

say, x = Sin(t)
 
Derivatives of order 4 & 5 can be used to find and classify the maximum/minimum accelerations, for example.
 

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