Pressure energy(fluid mechanics)

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Discussion Overview

The discussion centers around the concept of pressure energy in fluid mechanics, exploring its definition, calculations, and its relation to Bernoulli's theorem. Participants engage with both theoretical and practical aspects of pressure energy, including its implications in various scenarios.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Technical explanation
  • Debate/contested
  • Mathematical reasoning

Main Points Raised

  • Some participants assert that pressure times volume equates to energy, suggesting that changes in this product indicate changes in energy.
  • Others propose that a change in volume at constant pressure relates to energy changes, introducing concepts of internal energy and enthalpy with equations like dU = TdS - PdV and dH = TdS + VdP.
  • A participant expresses confusion regarding the relationship between pressure energy and the equation pressure energy = mgh, questioning its validity in the context of Bernoulli's theorem.
  • Some participants clarify that pressure and volume are context-dependent, providing examples such as the work done by a piston or the heart's function during a heartbeat.
  • There is contention regarding the statement that pressure energy equals mgh, with some arguing it is not universally true, especially in varying gravitational contexts.
  • Participants discuss the implications of Bernoulli's equation, noting that it involves multiple forms of pressure energy and that gravitational pressure is just one aspect.
  • One participant highlights that Bernoulli's equation assumes no external work is performed, emphasizing the relationship between static pressure energy, kinetic energy, and gravitational potential energy.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express differing views on the validity of equating pressure energy to mgh, with some asserting it is true under specific conditions while others contest its general applicability. The discussion remains unresolved regarding the precise definitions and implications of pressure energy in various contexts.

Contextual Notes

Participants note that the definitions of pressure and volume can vary based on the specific scenario being analyzed, and there are unresolved mathematical steps in the derivation of Bernoulli's theorem that may affect interpretations.

Godwin Kessy
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Can anyone please help me on the term pressure energy what does it really mean and If possible the calculations involved with it!
 
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Pressure times volume is energy. So if that product changes then the energy has changed.
 
Strictly speaking isn't change in volume times a constant pressure energy ?
so if you had a situation where your volume stayed constant but your volume changed you would have a change in enthalpy ? i.e
dU = TdS - PdV
dH = TdS + VdP
 
DaleSpam said:
Pressure times volume is energy. So if that product changes then the energy has changed.

Thank you for the reply,
But what is really that volume and the pressure.
May you please elaborated it, Probably by using the model for the derivation for Bernouli's Theorem!

You know what, I know its reasonable for the pressure energy to be involved i the calculations for bernouli's theorem, But I was shocked when it was written that;

Pressure energy=mgh

Thank you!
 
thrillhouse86 said:
Strictly speaking isn't change in volume times a constant pressure energy ?
so if you had a situation where your volume stayed constant but your volume changed you would have a change in enthalpy ? i.e
dU = TdS - PdV
dH = TdS + VdP



Excuse me! Am really out of phase for what you just explained!
May you tell ,e in detail may be would solve my problem!
But I was in the derivation for Bernouli's theorem,
How can pressure energy=mgh
Where h=Height above the point of which total energy is to be calculated!

And seriously am not yet familiar with enthalpy so may you elaborate more!
Thank you!
 
Godwin Kessy said:
But what is really that volume and the pressure.
May you please elaborated it
It is any volume that you are interested in and the pressure within that volume. For instance, if you are interested in the work done by a piston as it expands then you would take the pressure inside the piston times the volume of the piston at the beginning of the power stroke and at the end of the power stroke. The difference is the work done by the piston during the expansion.

Similarly, if you are interested in the work done by the heart in one heartbeat you can plot the left ventricular pressure by the left ventricular volume and find the area enclosed over one heartbeat.

If you are interested in the amount of work being done on a differential element of a fluid flow you can do the same thing.

Godwin Kessy said:
I was shocked when it was written that;

Pressure energy=mgh
You should be shocked, it is not true in general. For instance, in outer space g=0, so mgh = 0, but pressure times volume is still energy and pistons and compressors don't run without energy input! Also, consider on earth, you can heat a gas inside a closed container, this will increase P and therefore increase PV without changing mgh.
 
DaleSpam said:
You should be shocked, it is not true in general.

Seriously it is true am telling you! May be you should look it over and help me out!
Its under the derivation of Bernouli's theorem!
 
Godwin Kessy said:
Seriously it is true am telling you! May be you should look it over and help me out!
Its under the derivation of Bernouli's theorem!
you didn't get what Dale meant by "general". There are many different types of pressure energy including several others in bernoulli's equation. Pressure due to gravity is only one type.
 
  • #10
Godwin Kessy said:
Bernoulli ... Pressure energy=mgh
Not quite, it's an inverse relationship. Bernoulli's equation multiplied by volume results in:

static_pressure_energy + kinetic_energy + gravitational_potential_energy = constant

(Note Bernoulli's equation assumes no external work is performed).

For the gravitational component, using water as an example, as depth increases, static_pressure_energy increases, gravitational_potential_energy decreases, and vice versa.
 

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