A/C Electromagnet: Safety & Uses Explained

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the safety and functionality of A/C electromagnets, particularly focusing on their design, operation, and the implications of using alternating current. Participants explore the technical aspects of electromagnets, transformers, and the necessary precautions when working with electrical components.

Discussion Character

  • Technical explanation
  • Conceptual clarification
  • Debate/contested

Main Points Raised

  • One participant expresses concern about the safety of using an A/C electromagnet without clear instructions on controlling power, questioning the potential for short circuits and fuse issues.
  • Another participant points out that the article mentions using a variac to control voltage and current, which typically includes a fuse to prevent short circuits.
  • A participant seeks clarification on why a primary coil in a transformer can have voltage applied without being a short circuit, pondering the role of wire resistance and inductance.
  • It is noted that coils act as inductors, and when DC voltage is applied, they resist current rise, while AC circuits involve impedance rather than just resistance.
  • Questions arise regarding the number of turns needed in a coil to prevent short circuits and how a secondary coil can induce a higher voltage when placed near a primary coil.
  • Another participant emphasizes the importance of insulation between wire coils to ensure safety and proper function.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants exhibit a mix of agreement and uncertainty regarding the technical details of electromagnets and transformers. While some points are clarified, there remains a lack of consensus on specific safety measures and operational principles.

Contextual Notes

Participants discuss various assumptions about electrical resistance, impedance, and the design of coils without resolving the complexities involved in these concepts.

DkEnrgyFrk
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I am looking at electromagnets and discovered an article using an A/C version.
What I am surprised by is that there is no mention of how the A/C is being used.
http://www.coolmagnetman.com/magacem.htm
Wouldn't someone creating this version of an electromagnet kill themselves?
There's no mention whether the author uses any kind of lamp or anything to control the power running into this thing.
If this thing was wired into an outlet, wouldn't a fuse at the main's blow?
 
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You forgot the part on that page which says "Connect up a variac to the coil so you can control the voltage and current going to it."

The variac is also called auto-transformer. They usually have a fuse which would blow if you try to short circuit it.
 
I did read that wrong. I don't understand what that is yet, but I'm going to check wikipedia and see.

Why can a single coil like the one primary coil of a transformer have voltage applied to it without being a short circuit? Does the winding of wire create resistance? A transformer doesn't have any resistance attached to its primary coil does it?
 
Coils are inductors whether in transformers, electromagnets or something else.

When you apply DC voltage to an inductor, it tries to create a magnetic field which creates a force to resist the rise of current. The higher the frequency of breaking on and off the circuit with DC voltage, the longer it takes for the current to rise. if the frequency is high enough, the current in inductor shall never be able to rise to become a short circuit.

For a standard inductor with L Henry inductance, connected across AC of frequency f Hz, the effective resistance is 2*PI*f*L ohms. This is also called reactance.
 
DkEnrgyFrk said:
...Why can a single coil like the one primary coil of a transformer have voltage applied to it without being a short circuit? Does the winding of wire create resistance? A transformer doesn't have any resistance attached to its primary coil does it?

the primary winding will have a DC resistance maybe a few 10's of ohms or 100's of ohms

But in an AC circuit we don't so much look at that resistance value ... rather because its a coil ( an inductor) it has an impedance to the AC current flowing through it

DC circuit we call it resistance
AC circuit we call it impedance

its that impedance that stops a relatively low wire resistance from becoming a short circuit to the AC current

Do a google search on Impedance ( AC impedance) and have some fun learning :)

Dave
 
That is absolutely amazing. Thanks for the replies.

How many wraps/turns of a wire constitutes a coil that can resist(DC)/impede(AC) a short circuit?
A 12 gauge wire can be connected to a 120v outlet and as long as there are enough turns, we have a transformer primary without short? And if I create another coil of wiring that's brought closer to it, with more turns, a higher voltage will be induced across it, becomes the secondary?
 
Yea, I guess so. But the coils of the wire should be insulated from each other, that's important.
 

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