How Do Yachts Reflect Global Wealth Disparities?

[RonL]

I knew there were very rich people in the world...but finding a site that is dedicated to yachts opened a shocking reality of what is in the world.
Hope it is enjoyed by some...:)

http://www.yachtforums.com/forums/l...worlds-largest-yacht-lurssens-180m-azzam.html

 

[dlgoff]

Isn't that OmCheeto's boat?

 

[RonL]

Isn't that OmCheeto's boat?

No I think his is about a meter less in length...

 

[russ_watters]

Er, most of what is on that site are small yachts that middle-class people own.

 

[RonL]

Er, most of what is on that site are small yachts that middle-class people own.

http://www.yachtforums.com/forums/boat-shows-yacht-watching/3199-yachts-gibraltar.html

Scan through this thread...I was amazed.

Then again my eyes were opened just a couple of years ago, not sure how one can live in oblivion to such an extent, but I guess ambitions did not require a reason to make those kinds of observations ?

Ron

 

[bp_psy]

The boat is nice , but can I have it gold plated?

 

[RonL]

The boat is nice , but can I have it gold plated?

Sure, why not?...just drop the gold at this address...XXXX,XX. I'll get right on it

 

[russ_watters]

http://www.yachtforums.com/forums/boat-shows-yacht-watching/3199-yachts-gibraltar.html

Scan through this thread...I was amazed.

Ok...so the guy likes to take pictures of yachts. What am I missing?

[edit] Are you just surprised at how many there are? There are 1,400 billionaires in the world...

 

[RonL]

Ok...so the guy likes to take pictures of yachts. What am I missing?

[edit] Are you just surprised at how many there are? There are 1,400 billionaires in the world...

Could be an age difference, during the time I grew up a millionaire was a big thing, the pictures are of yachts owned by people of greater wealth than my definition of middle class or even upper middle class...maybe I'm still out of touch

 

[russ_watters]

Could be an age difference, during the time I grew up a millionaire was a big thing...

Well sure - it's called "inflation".

...the pictures are of yachts owned by people of greater wealth than my definition of middle class or even upper middle class...maybe I'm still out of touch

The yachts pictured in that one thread are not owned by people who are middle class, they are owned by the super-rich. But that is a small part of that "site dedicated to yachts". Most of the yachts discussed in the site are not anywhere close to that big/expensive. Most are owned by people who qualify as "middle class" (yes, mostly upper middle class) in the West.

 

[OmCheeto]

Ron! Long time no see.

I was just thinking about you yesterday. An acquaintance at work mentioned a new KERS system. Unfortunately, he could not remember the name of the company. But it made my head spin trying to once again solve the engineering problems involved.

Which also reminded me of someone from a previous science forum that I used to peruse:

...Instead of using wind, you use magnetic + & - ?...on 1 side have it repeling the spinning object & on the other side have it attracting...& could you use electro magnets?... the energy produced by the spinning object would power the electro magnets, causing more spin, causing more power (like a turbo)

bolding mine

Who I later found out had the surname of "Wells". Brilliant young man, btw.

"Wells" also happens to be the surname of the family that sold me my yacht:

a stunning 488 cm piece of art​

hmmmm... I appear to be off topic, as this looks like a bunch of random thoughts...

hmmm... whatever... Did you see the yachts that I was going to buy for myself and lisab?

For me:

solar powered of course.

and for lisab:

5500 mile range

Which is perfect, as the sun doesn't always shine, and we can tow each other, depending on cloud cover, all the way to Bora Bora, which I've recently discovered, is very nearly 5500 miles from the Straights of Juan De Fuca.

We will of course stop off at Pearl Harbor, and visit with B.Elliot, as he seems to be in a pissy mood as of late. Perhaps lisab and I can convince him and the crew of his submarine to join us. Now that would be an adventure.

 

[OmCheeto]

ps. Do not ever go for a submarine ride through the Straits of Juan de Fuca. As I recall, I threw up in my mouth that day...

That stupid kid at the SPCP from Montana kept making barfing noises, while the kid at the RPCP from California was barfing into a transparent garbage bag, while I was sitting at the EPCP, watching , and listening, and...

oh the memories...

 

[RonL]

Ron! Long time no see.

I was just thinking about you yesterday. An acquaintance at work mentioned a new KERS system. Unfortunately, he could not remember the name of the company. But it made my head spin trying to once again solve the engineering problems involved.

It takes a lot of time in the shop to build a... Magnetic Monopole :shy: now there is a need to know why??

 

[OmCheeto]

pps. Although, as they say; "What doesn't kill you, makes you stronger"

My six brothers and sisters one day decided that we should all go deep sea fishing, way up off the coast of the Olympic Peninsula. I had better things to do with my time, but they insisted I go along.

I was the only one that didn't end up "chumming".

What a freakin' blast!

I seem to remember hanging off the bow, in a most Titanic type way.

and making fun of everyone.

 

[jim hardy]

Thanks for the thread. Ahhh nostalgia... The yachts reminded me of my childhood in northwest Miami.
About 1960 (7th grade) i built a 12 foot plywood skiff and fixed up an ancient outboard motor. Mom would drop us kids at Miami River and we'd motor about six miles to Biscayne Bay.. what wonderful Saturdays...



One of the sights was Merrill Stevens drydock. In wintertime we marvelled at the huge polished mahogany transoms on millionaire's yachts there...
Of course back then this was a yacht:

picture courtesy this outfit:http://seattle.showmethead.com/boats/15450055-grebe-motor-yacht_18574414.html

We once saw Cousteau's Calypso there.

i see Merrill Stevens is still there under new ownership.

Thanks for the dream fellows - i feel like I've been back to 1960 for a few minutes.

 

[OmCheeto]

It takes a lot of time in the shop to build a... Magnetic Monopole :shy: now there is a need to know why??

Monopoles!? Good god.

google google google

?

Are you talking about this post:

https://www.physicsforums.com/showpost.php?p=3551533&postcount=247

There is greed, and there is the desire not to be poor, and there is science.

About 10-20 years ago I was researching a crackpot theory that magnetic monopoles might exist. I read many papers by many physicists on some CERN preprint server. I even made hard copies! I looked up one author one day and found his personal web page. He didn't say he went into the field to be rich, he said he didn't want to be poor.

There is a great difference between multi-m/billion dollar greed, and not wanting to live under a bridge.

 

[OmCheeto]

Thanks for the thread. Ahhh nostalgia... The yachts reminded me of my childhood in northwest Miami.
About 1960 (7th grade) i built a 12 foot plywood skiff and fixed up an ancient outboard motor. Mom would drop us kids at Miami River and we'd motor about six miles to Biscayne Bay.. what wonderful Saturdays...



One of the sights was Merrill Stevens drydock. In wintertime we marvelled at the huge polished mahogany transoms on millionaire's yachts there...
Of course back then this was a yacht:

picture courtesy this outfit:http://seattle.showmethead.com/boats/15450055-grebe-motor-yacht_18574414.html

We once saw Cousteau's Calypso there.

i see Merrill Stevens is still there under new ownership.

Thanks for the dream fellows - i feel like I've been back to 1960 for a few minutes.

Sometimes I feel like the kids are actually thinking of us when they start these threads.

hmmm... Is there a senile old fart dementia thread yet about boats? or visa versa?

 

[jim hardy]

Sometimes I feel like the kids are actually thinking of us when they start these threads.

hmmm... Is there a senile old fart dementia thread yet about boats? or visa versa?

aha ! for starters:

http://forum.woodenboat.com/showthr...chts-from-100-years-ago&p=3756912#post3756912

http://www.woodworkforums.com/f32/

http://intheboatshed.net/2013/02/07/steam-yachts-of-a-century-ago-from-jeff-coles-collection/#

 

[OmCheeto]

I drove to work this last Wednesday and Thursday, with no radio, no cd player, no 8-track player, no i-pod.

Total silence.

I spent the entire 45 minute drive each day, designing and constructing chimera kayaks in my head.

I described my thoughts to a friend at work on Thursday, and he mentioned something about Inuit "split prow" kayaks being more efficient. I could not picture what on Earth he was talking about, nor does google bring anything up. He mentioned that it was similar to the "whale catcher" bulbous things that stick out underwater from large ocean going vessels.

I'm guessing this is my 7th research project...

 

[jim hardy]

http://www.invaluable.com/auction-lot/an-inuit-model-kayak-1035-c-4be1866e57

 

[OmCheeto]

http://www.invaluable.com/auction-lot/an-inuit-model-kayak-1035-c-4be1866e57

hmmm... That appears to be a totally cosmetic design, as the split is above the waterline.

My idea was more in line with the following:

Except that the canopy would be a 16 x 8 ft array of solar panels, yielding ~2 hp.
The pontoons would be a pair of mini-me sea kayaks, ~16 feet in length.
So that would be 350 lbs for the panels, 150 lbs for me, 100 lbs for the boat = 600 lbs.
With hydrofoils of course.
Kind of like a water skimmer bug, only scaled up a bit.

Good god! Solar panels are $1 per watt! I need to go shopping!

hmmm... It looks like I have some building and experimenting to do this summer.

The gentleman who originally designed all of my boats had a patent on how to steam form plywood. He and his son discovered that they were allergic to the epoxies involved with making fiberglass boats, back in the 60's, and got out of the business. (It may have been a psychological allergy. I understand the love of wood.) But in rebuilding my boat, I decided that, not only was I not allergic to the epoxies, I could build a boat about as fast as, if not faster, then they could, with modern materials.

Om's dream #6: Start a boat building company.

-----------------------
People keep asking me what I'm going to do once I retire, in a kind of; "You won't have anything to do. You worked your whole life. And you won't have that to do anymore. What are you going to do? What are you going to do? What are you going to do?

I find the question very annoying. I've been planning my whole life, what I will do. I have 42 hobbies. I know what I'll do, and then some...

 

[RonL]

hmmm... That appears to be a totally cosmetic design, as the split is above the waterline.

My idea was more in line with the following:

Except that the canopy would be a 16 x 8 ft array of solar panels, yielding ~2 hp.
The pontoons would be a pair of mini-me sea kayaks, ~16 feet in length.
So that would be 350 lbs for the panels, 150 lbs for me, 100 lbs for the boat = 600 lbs.
With hydrofoils of course.
Kind of like a water skimmer bug, only scaled up a bit.

Good god! Solar panels are $1 per watt! I need to go shopping!

hmmm... It looks like I have some building and experimenting to do this summer.

The gentleman who originally designed all of my boats had a patent on how to steam form plywood. He and his son discovered that they were allergic to the epoxies involved with making fiberglass boats, back in the 60's, and got out of the business. (It may have been a psychological allergy. I understand the love of wood.) But in rebuilding my boat, I decided that, not only was I not allergic to the epoxies, I could build a boat about as fast as, if not faster, then they could, with modern materials.

Om's dream #6: Start a boat building company.

-----------------------
People keep asking me what I'm going to do once I retire, in a kind of; "You won't have anything to do. You worked your whole life. And you won't have that to do anymore. What are you going to do? What are you going to do? What are you going to do?

I find the question very annoying. I've been planning my whole life, what I will do. I have 42 hobbies. I know what I'll do, and then some...

I have officially retired and now enjoy a very casual daily routine, limited funds is a good method of control in preventing physical exhaustion at the end of a day. It is also a drag when there are so many things one has planned to do after retirement.

Thought that was a girl on the raft, but using the zoom function, it appears to be a young man and he seems to be enjoying the rig. It might be my tri-focals, but the mass above water seems to be much greater than 4 pvc tubes will float ?
Best wishes if you start that boat business

My new dream is how to find a way to fit my plans and hobbies into the short time left ? Between PF and Wikipedia one thing learned leads to the necessity of learning ten other things...I seem to be in the snowball effect.

jim hardy, thanks for those links

Ron

Om, I would not think any cosmetics would be involved in such a tool as the kayak represents to that lifestyle, my first thought is a point of force control that keeps a harpoon line from flipping the craft?

 

[OmCheeto]

I have officially retired

Yay! Next month starts my one year count down. (Yay!)⁹

and now enjoy a very casual daily routine, limited funds is a good method of control in preventing physical exhaustion at the end of a day. It is also a drag when there are so many things one has planned to do after retirement.

Thought that was a girl on the raft, but using the zoom function, it appears to be a young man and he seems to be enjoying the rig. It might be my tri-focals, but the mass above water seems to be much greater than 4 pvc tubes will float ?

They may be 6" tubes.
By my calculations, 4 of them would provide ~490 lbs of buoyancy.
If they were only 4" tubes, then 4 tubes would only provide ~218 lbs of buoyancy.

But the blunt ends of the tubes would really be a drag. My friends are always talking me into dragging logs up and down the river so they can make volley ball poles. One 8" pole creates more drag than a boat load of people. I've been contemplating designing a nose cone in the shape of a kayak bow.

Best wishes if you start that boat business

It will probably be the last business I start. Unless of course the solar hybrid hammock rocket sled becomes popular.

hmm...

HOBBY STARTS BIG BOAT BUSINESS​

...
He completed a 14-foot boat in time to enter it in the Fourth of July outboard motor races in Grays Harbor in 1939, where it took first place in its class. From that time on Burch began to receive orders for similar boats. However, when he asked for sufficient exterior plywood for a hundred boats, the Harbor Plywood people worked closely with him and wanted him to try a few at a time to be certain that the plywood would hold up under the new use. The exterior panels proved their worth and the glue lines held. Burch established the Burchcraft Boat Co., now one of the country's largest producers of all-plywood pleasure craft.

Good thing LisaB is my friend. I hear she has a PhD in plywood.

My new dream is how to find a way to fit my plans and hobbies into the short time left ? Between PF and Wikipedia one thing learned leads to the necessity of learning ten other things...I seem to be in the snowball effect.

I lost internet access a few weeks ago. (I forgot to pay my bill. )
I got more things done that weekend than in the last 10 years.

jim hardy, thanks for those links

Ron

Om, I would not think any cosmetics would be involved in such a tool as the kayak represents to that lifestyle, my first thought is a point of force control that keeps a harpoon line from flipping the craft?

Looking at it again, I've decided that it may simply be a pair of handles such that they can carry the craft more easily, when out of the water. Occam's razor.

 

[RonL]

Yay! Next month starts my one year count down. (Yay!)⁹They may be 6" tubes.
By my calculations, 4 of them would provide ~490 lbs of buoyancy.
If they were only 4" tubes, then 4 tubes would only provide ~218 lbs of buoyancy.

But the blunt ends of the tubes would really be a drag. My friends are always talking me into dragging logs up and down the river so they can make volley ball poles. One 8" pole creates more drag than a boat load of people. I've been contemplating designing a nose cone in the shape of a kayak bow.
It will probably be the last business I start. Unless of course the solar hybrid hammock rocket sled becomes popular.

hmm...


Good thing LisaB is my friend. I hear she has a PhD in plywood.


I lost internet access a few weeks ago. (I forgot to pay my bill. )
I got more things done that weekend than in the last 10 years.

Looking at it again, I've decided that it may simply be a pair of handles such that they can carry the craft more easily, when out of the water. Occam's razor.

LisaB and plywood ?...best I not comment

One reason I have been just a lurker and very limited at that, is the addictive nature of PF and other sites of interest...real time killers...yet if one is trying to learn, the question becomes where to draw the line.

I can agree with the handles, that does make more sense. Using them in other ways will translate into carrying more gear, which translates into more weight plus the food that instigated the trip in the first place....there I go again (over analyzing once more)

 

[RonL]

Thanks for the thread. Ahhh nostalgia... The yachts reminded me of my childhood in northwest Miami.
About 1960 (7th grade) i built a 12 foot plywood skiff and fixed up an ancient outboard motor. Mom would drop us kids at Miami River and we'd motor about six miles to Biscayne Bay.. what wonderful Saturdays...



One of the sights was Merrill Stevens drydock. In wintertime we marvelled at the huge polished mahogany transoms on millionaire's yachts there...
Of course back then this was a yacht:

picture courtesy this outfit:http://seattle.showmethead.com/boats/15450055-grebe-motor-yacht_18574414.html

We once saw Cousteau's Calypso there.

i see Merrill Stevens is still there under new ownership.

Thanks for the dream fellows - i feel like I've been back to 1960 for a few minutes.

Jim, you mention Miami in 1960, do you know anything about a company by the name of AlimCraft ? they manufactured a deep V boat in 1963 that performed well. I have a hull (not much more than scrap) and cannot find much info about what happened to the company.

Best I have found is the possible issues with WellCraft over patents ?

Thanks
Ron

 

[jim hardy]

Jim, you mention Miami in 1960, do you know anything about a company by the name of AlimCraft ? they manufactured a deep V boat in 1963 that performed well. I have a hull (not much more than scrap) and cannot find much info about what happened to the company.

Best I have found is the possible issues with WellCraft over patents ?

Thanks
Ron

Roni I do not remember Alim.
There were LOTS of small boat manufacturers around then, several survived and moved elsewhere. Thunderbird was within bicycle distance of my house, we kids used to go watch the guys laying up fiberglass. They became an upscale manufacturer, 'Formula'...

I did find one forum where Alim is mentioned,
http://www.screamandfly.com/showthread.php?78723-Alim
It appears an Alim or two may have been used in Bay of Pigs fiasco...

a fellow named Hunt is said to have been inventor.

The first Deep Vee I ever saw was from my little skiff , we were behind Bertram Yacht yard near the airport. It was the most unusual hull i'd ever seen, inside a shelter and covered with a tarp. Name on transom was "Moppie". Later that year it made headlines when it won the Miami-Nassau boat race by a huge margin.

That started the Deep Vee movement.

Here's a link on that Moppie
http://www.bertram31.com/ray_hunt.htm

That very boat is used in the opening scene of movie "The Happening", a not very good movie whose redeeming features are Faye Dunaway(when she was very young) and Anthony Quinn.

If you have an early Alim hull it just might be quite collectible.
Maybe you'd post a photo...
Miami Science Museum used to have an invitation-only antique boat collection in a little known warehouse in Coconut Grove near Ralph Munroe's old "Barnacle".
I've not communicated with them since ~1990 - might be worth trying to find them.
http://www.miamisci.org/

good luck !

old jim

 

[jim hardy]

another Fla maritime museum:

http://www.mcbmfl.org/index.php/history/introduction

and more from that forum:
http://www.screamandfly.com/showthread.php?78723-Alim/page2

Alim Marine was located in North Miami until 1968. The previous owner George Blumberg took the molds for the v-20 to Sarasota where it became part of the new Wellcraft line I bought the plant in Norh Miami from Georgie B.as he was called. He had pushed out the true designers of the Alim V20 ( whose names I can no longer recall ) in order to get their patent on the V_STEP LIFT HULL. The former partners went on to build Vega Boats in Hialeah but failed . He then threatened suit on Glasspar, Bertram, SeaRay, etc if they did not pay him a royalty. Ray Hunt who had designed the Moppie for Bertram started a suit against him and challenged the Alim patent. Both lost out as the court declared both of their patents invalid due to earlier patents that eluded to the same principle. I built the V-30 (an exactly enlarged version of the v-20 fo a time) However newer designs from Jim Wynne and Walt Walters had made it obsolete and I gave it up. I raced a cut down version of the V-20 along with Randy Zimmerman that had a Chrysler hemi in numerous races.

In it's day the Alim V-20 outperformed any other 20 footer in the world in
rough water and it is still a great boat for that purpose as wellas to stay dry bcause of the rounded fore deck and unusual gunnell created by it.

That explains why I don't know of them - North Miami was beyond ordinary bicycle cruising distance. I grew up in Miami Springs.. probably within fifteen miles, though.

 

[RonL]

another Fla maritime museum:

http://www.mcbmfl.org/index.php/history/introduction

and more from that forum:
http://www.screamandfly.com/showthread.php?78723-Alim/page2



That explains why I don't know of them - North Miami was beyond ordinary bicycle cruising distance. I grew up in Miami Springs.. probably within fifteen miles, though.

Thanks Jim, that is far more information than I have found up to now. I will look into the value as an antique or collectors boat. The transom and stringers are an absolute rebuild and having found a site that shows a few in depth repairs on WellCraft Deep V20's (they are identical) the cost for materials only is in the 5K range...lots of boats on the trailer, ready to hit the water can be found for half that price. That is why I have let it set for a long time.

A rebuild or even a stretch job are well within my abilities, it comes down to how the final years are going to be used, it would take something really special to bring that project anywhere close to the top of the bucket list it will set where it is in case I get really bored with other projects.

Too many dreams to work on

Thanks again

Ron

This is the only picture I have ready, an ad for the company.
The picture didn't go where I thought it would, I'll save changes and see how it looks.

 

[jim hardy]

I had a Wellcraft 18 which is not deep vee.
It was perfect for Fla Bay between Keys and Flamingo... and the reefs in fair weather.
It raised the kids.

Enjoy your retirement.
Have you read "Spoon River Anthology" ? It'll help you get in right mindset... Look up 'Fiddler Jones'

 

[RonL]

I had a Wellcraft 18 which is not deep vee.
It was perfect for Fla Bay between Keys and Flamingo... and the reefs in fair weather.
It raised the kids.

Enjoy your retirement.
Have you read "Spoon River Anthology" ? It'll help you get in right mindset... Look up 'Fiddler Jones'

Well I got a picture on the page at least

I will look into the two suggestions.

Thanks

 

[jim hardy]

Well I got a picture on the page at least: cool:

That hull shape was immensely popular. They run fine but roll a lot at anchor.

1850 NE 144th st - yes that was out of my territory.
Anything N of 95th street was "Up North"; Ft Lauderdale was "Way up north"

old jim