Basic physics confusion in my structure

Click For Summary

Homework Help Overview

The discussion revolves around a physics problem involving two stacked boxes, where the top box has a mass of 3 kg and the bottom box has a mass of 7 kg. The system accelerates at 1 m/s², and participants are trying to understand the forces acting on the bottom block and the appropriate mass to use in calculations.

Discussion Character

  • Conceptual clarification, Assumption checking

Approaches and Questions Raised

  • Participants explore the reasoning behind using the mass of only the bottom block versus the combined mass of both blocks. Questions arise about the definitions of the objects in the problem and how to apply Newton's laws correctly.

Discussion Status

Some participants have offered insights into the application of Newton's laws, suggesting that when analyzing forces on the bottom block, one should use the mass of that block. There is an ongoing exploration of how to interpret the problem and the forces involved.

Contextual Notes

There are mentions of frictional forces between the blocks and the floor, which complicate the analysis. Participants express confusion about how to separate the blocks for the purpose of applying physics principles, particularly in relation to the problem's requirements.

x86
Gold Member
Messages
256
Reaction score
18
My physics core is a little bit weak, and this one question confuses me.

Homework Statement


A 3kg box sits on top of a 7 kg box. The object accelerates at 1 m/s^2. Find the force applied on the bottom block; if there are no forces besides this one.


Homework Equations


F= ma


The Attempt at a Solution


So, my initial attempt was F = m * a. m = 7kg + 3kg = 10 kg. F = 10 N.

However, this is incorrect. The answer is supposed to be 3 kg. They only take the bottom block into account and this is extremely confusing for me. Of course, this is from an even larger kinematics question; but this is the only step I do not understand. And it's basically exactly the same as the one I'm asking now.

Why do we use 3 kg, and not 10 kg?
 
Physics news on Phys.org
What is "the object" here?
 
The object would be the two blocks, relative to the ground. Could one split this larger object into two smaller objects, and say the force on the bottom block is 7N and the force on the top block is 3N?

I'll tell you the bigger question, that I summarized.

So basically there's two blocks sitting on top of each other. The friction between the blocks is 15 N and the friction between the block and the floor is 10 N.

This means on the bottom block there is a force of 5 N (forward) [since the top block is the one moving, and the frictional force is causing the bottom block to move]

So I'm confused as what mass to use now to find the acceleration.

F = ma

Would it be the mass of the two blocks combined, or can I just use the mass of the bottom block? This is very confusing for me. The correct answer uses only the mass of the bottom block, but I don't understand why
 
Last edited:
I suggest that you state the problem EXACTLY as it was given.
 
I apologize for not being clear.

Okay, so basically there is this block:

knight_Figure_08_32.jpg


The friction between the two blocks (Us = 0.6) and between the floor and the block is Us = 0.2

I draw a freebody diagram and see for the bottom block there is a force of friction with the floor to the left and a force of friction with the block on top to the right, causing said block to move right.

We can say that Ff_block - Ff_floor = ma

Which gives me 9.8 N = ma

I'm confused as to what to use for the mass. The correct answer uses 3kg for the mass, but it should be using 7kg as that's the objects weight. So it seems as if they are splitting the block up. How can they do this? I don't understand how they can use 3 kg for the mass
 
What are you supposed to find? What else is given?
 
x86 said:
I'm confused as to what to use for the mass. The correct answer uses 3kg for the mass, but it should be using 7kg as that's the objects weight. So it seems as if they are splitting the block up. How can they do this? I don't understand how they can use 3 kg for the mass
If you are analyzing forces on the bottom block then of course you'll use the mass of that block in applying Newton's laws.
 
  • Like
Likes   Reactions: 1 person
Doc Al said:
If you are analyzing forces on the bottom block then of course you'll use the mass of that block in applying Newton's laws.

Ah that's all I really wanted to know, I guess. I was confused, because I was thinking of both blocks as one object
 

Similar threads

Replies
7
Views
2K
Replies
17
Views
2K
  • · Replies 11 ·
Replies
11
Views
3K
  • · Replies 3 ·
Replies
3
Views
4K
Replies
4
Views
2K
  • · Replies 17 ·
Replies
17
Views
14K
Replies
18
Views
3K
  • · Replies 6 ·
Replies
6
Views
2K
Replies
6
Views
2K
  • · Replies 5 ·
Replies
5
Views
2K