Berlin: 9 November 1989 - A Historic Day Remembered

[jtbell]

This is one of the handful of dates that I remember for where I was and what I was doing, as with the JFK assassination and the Challenger shuttle disaster.

It was on a Friday. My wife (who teaches German) had gone with a colleague to Atlanta for a language-teachers' convention that weekend, and I was to drive to Atlanta the next day to join her. So I was alone in the house when I came back from work. It was a bit later than usual, so when I turned on the TV for the news, it was halfway through the 6 PM local news, just before the weather. I caught what looked like the tail end of an interview with a local resident about something that was happening in Berlin. It's unusual for our local news programs to have stories related to world affairs, so I figured something big had happened, and set the VCR (remember those?) to record the NBC Nightly News which followed at 6:30.

That broadcast had Tom Brokaw reporting live from the Brandenburg Gate. At the beginning, a huge crowd was massed in front of the wall (the west side), and the East German police were shooting water from fire hoses on the other side, to keep people off. By the end of the broadcast, the police had given that up, people had climbed up on the wall from both sides, and had started chipping off pieces.

I was so overcome by what I had seen that I left the house to go to campus, hoping to find someone in the computer lab or somewhere that I could talk to. Right after closing the door I realized that although I had my car key, I didn't have my house key! And my wife was out of town. So I ended up driving to a colleague's house, where we tracked down a locksmith and got him to break into my house for me.

I've still got that recording of the NBC News broadcast, which I transferred to DVD several years ago. You can also find a link to a copy of part the broadcast here. (Actually, almost the entire show was given over to coverage of the events in Berlin.)

 

[Sorry!]

I was 10 months old.

 

[lisab]

I was 10 months old.

Wow...I bet you cried, Sorry (haha).

I was 26, exactly and in college still (um, yes, I took the long route). There was no TV where I lived. I heard about it on the radio while I was jogging around Green Lake in Seattle...I remember it well. But I thought they meant, the wall had fallen because it was poorly made, hahaha. I wasn't really paying much attention, my focus then was on school (and jogging).

 

[Sorry!]

Wow...I bet you cried, Sorry (haha).

I was 26, exactly and in college still (um, yes, I took the long route). There was no TV where I lived. I heard about it on the radio while I was jogging around Green Lake in Seattle...I remember it well. But I thought they meant, the wall had fallen because it was poorly made, hahaha. I wasn't really paying much attention, my focus then was on school (and jogging).

I probably was crying ;) Such a beautiful day.

 

[Mgt3]

I was almost a year and a half old. I have a piece of the Berlin wall mounted on marble.

 

[DrClapeyron]

But did it stop illegal immigration?

 

[jtbell]

While it was up, it did a pretty good job of stopping illegal emigration.

 

[lisab]

While it was up, it did a pretty good job of stopping illegal emigration.

The wall did some of that...but I think the sharp shooters in the watchtowers did a good deal of the dissuasion, though.

 

[russ_watters]

While it was up, it did a pretty good job of stopping illegal emigration.

And there wasn't much illegal immigration anyway...

The wall did some that...but I think the sharp shooters in the watchtowers did a good deal of the dissuasion, though.

The mines didn't hurt either!

 

[russ_watters]

I was a teenager when it happened. I remember watching it on TV at home and realizing how profound it was, but I can't seem to remember quite the vivid details other people do about where they were and what they were doing at the time of such events.

 

[SticksandStones]

I was only 6 months old at the time. Glad I was alive when it happened though. Even if I can't claim to have even known about it till much later in life, it's nice to be able to say "this happened in my lifetime".

 

[Office_Shredder]

It's amazing how much of a difference between east and west Berlin there is even today

 

[DanP]

While it was up, it did a pretty good job of stopping illegal emigration.

So did bullets. Corpses won't proceed with further attempts to immigrate.

 

[DanP]

I remembered I didn't cared to much. If anything, the event constituted a reassurance that the changes sweeping through Eastern Europe at that time will continue. Although I was glad for the German ppl.

I was 16 at the time, living in Romania in a town near the border with Hungary . We all hoped that the events started by Hungary in august 89 will have a "chain effect". They did. Berlin wall was a high profile event, with a lot of international coverage. In my country the moment arrived in mid December. Unfortunately, it wasn't peaceful as in other places. It was violent and ended up in bloodshed. In several city tanks where roaming on the streets. Fortunately, the army sided very fast with the population demanding a change of regime.

I later learned about the "Prague spring". I think Prague Spring was a trully important event, and represents better than any other event the opposition of humans to the cancer called "communism"

 

[mheslep]

I later learned about the "Prague spring". I think Prague Spring was a trully important event, and represents better than any other event the opposition of humans to the cancer called "communism"

You had no information about the Prague Spring prior to 1989?

 

[Andre]

I later learned about the "Prague spring". I think Prague Spring was a trully important event, and represents better than any other event the opposition of humans to the cancer called "communism"

How about the Hungarian revoltion or the Polish solidarity strikes??

 

[Borek]

This is one of the handful of dates that I remember for where I was and what I was doing, as with the JFK assassination and the Challenger shuttle disaster.

Symptomatically - I DON'T remember. I suppose that's because for us here, in Poland, that was just an echo of things that have happened earlier here.

 

[DanP]

You had no information about the Prague Spring prior to 1989?

Of course we did, but not in newspapers, books, and so. Only what out parents friends would have told us. I had very little information because I wasn't very interested in my teen ages at all in history of Eastern Europe.

 

[DanP]

How about the Hungarian revoltion or the Polish solidarity strikes??

I know about them and I know how I feel about Prague is pretty subjective, but that's it. I guess it what impress you more at a certain time.

 

[Borek]

How about the Hungarian revoltion or the Polish solidarity strikes??

There were more. For obvious reasons I know mostly about events in Poland:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Poznań_1956_protests

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1968_Polish_political_crisis

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Polish_1970_protests

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/June_1976_protests

 

[DrClapeyron]

How about the Hungarian revoltion or the Polish solidarity strikes??

No one seems to mention the http://research.stlouisfed.org/publications/review/73/10/Russian_Oct1973.pdf".

 

[mheslep]

Obama phoned in some remarks:
http://www.whitehouse.gov/photos-and-video/video/potus-berlin-wall

Not bad. No mention of the Soviet Union, Stalin, etc.

 

[russ_watters]

Symptomatically - I DON'T remember. I suppose that's because for us here, in Poland, that was just an echo of things that have happened earlier here.

Of course people tend to remember national events better than world events, but it surprises me that you don't see this one as having more significance. Poland was one of many battlefields in the cold war and those incidents you listed were some skirmishes, but Berlin was the main front in the war. When the Berlin Wall fell, that was essentially the end of the Cold War.

Put another way - those types of incidents you listed stopped after the Berlin Wall fell because the war was over. It truly was the defining political event of the second half of the 20th century.

One thing about the Challenger, it is one of the very small handful of memorable news moments for me. I was in elementary school when it happened and it was considered newsworthy enough to make an announcement over the school loudspeaker about it. But in the grand scheme of things, it was a pretty insignificant event. For a "tragedy", it was pretty small: 7 people died. It was expensive, but why does that make it important enough to interrupt a school day? The reason is national pride. The space program is an instrumet of national pride. As a result, it carries vastly more significance for Americans than for people in other countries.

 

[russ_watters]

I remembered I didn't cared to much. If anything, the event constituted a reassurance that the changes sweeping through Eastern Europe at that time will continue. Although I was glad for the German ppl.

I was 16 at the time, living in Romania in a town near the border with Hungary . We all hoped that the events started by Hungary in august 89 will have a "chain effect". They did. Berlin wall was a high profile event, with a lot of international coverage. In my country the moment arrived in mid December. Unfortunately, it wasn't peaceful as in other places. It was violent and ended up in bloodshed. In several city tanks where roaming on the streets. Fortunately, the army sided very fast with the population demanding a change of regime.

I later learned about the "Prague spring". I think Prague Spring was a trully important event, and represents better than any other event the opposition of humans to the cancer called "communism"

Similar to my post above - yes, there are many, many events that demonstrate peoples' opposition to communism in Europe during the cold war. That's not what this night was about. It wasn't a protest, it was a party. A party celebrating the end of those protests - the day the protests happened to make happen.

 

[mheslep]

It truly was the defining political event of the second half of the 20th century. ...

I strongly agree. However, a sizable a chunk of the (US) population, maybe half, disagrees and answers that question differently.

Answer for the other half:

Spoiler

Vietnam

 

[DanP]

Of course people tend to remember national events better than world events, but it surprises me that you don't see this one as having more significance. Poland was one of many battlefields in the cold war and those incidents you listed were some skirmishes, but Berlin was the main front in the war. When the Berlin Wall fell, that was essentially the end of the Cold War.

Put another way - those types of incidents you listed stopped after the Berlin Wall fell because the war was over. It truly was the defining political event of the second half of the 20th century.

The problem with the Berlin wall, it's that is just a symbol. (With the obvious exception of Germany) A high visibility event, good for political speeches and media. It's "fall" was a consequence of the cold ward drawing to an end, and not viceversa.

Signs that cold war draws to an end started in 85, once Gorbachev acceded to power in USSR. It was a long process, with long political negotiations and probably greatly accelerated by the economical climate in USSR, process which ended in 1991.

The incidents like the ones mentioned by Borek didnt stopped because the wall collapsed.
They did stop because the countries in question managed to overthrow their communist regimes. With external help, and profiting from the international climate and the fact USSR was too busy to lick his wounds, no doubt about it.

We usually tend to put significance in events which "mark" us. The fall of Berlin was a peaceful event, with no bloodshed. Nice to look at TV and Pink Floyd made a great album.

In my country , December '89 was bloody. Ppl have died. And not one or two, but in the order of thousands. Tanks on the street, close quarter fights in the city , all the "cool" stuff... It was the only place in Europe where there where violent conflicts, and weapons had to be used to end the communist regime

The end of cold war was the most significant event in politics in the second half of XX century. The Berlin wall was just a symbol many associate with it.Just my 2 cents. No combative intentions :P

 

[DanP]

One of the things which appeal to me in "skirmishes" like Prague Spring (and others, like the Hungarian events, Polish strikes) was the fact that they happened at a time when USSR ruled with an iron fist. Nobody messed with USSR back then :P

The man and women who where involved had balls. Balls of steel.

 

[DanP]

Similar to my post above - yes, there are many, many events that demonstrate peoples' opposition to communism in Europe during the cold war. That's not what this night was about. It wasn't a protest, it was a party. A party celebrating the end of those protests - the day the protests happened to make happen.

I hear you Russ, but for many of us it wasn't the end.

The end for Romanians came ~2 months later at the end of December. I guess we wasn't in the best mood for a party in early days of Novemeber. There was a still a lot of tension here.
Ppl still had to wake at 4 AM so they can buy some milk or meat for their offspring. They couldn't talk about Berlin wall or anything else because fear of reprisals

Don't get me wrong, I was glad when I heard the wall had fallen. But I think most ppl where too anxious to think when it will end here as well to really enjoy the Berlin party.

 

[mheslep]

Vaclav Klaus interview on the Wall
http://tv.nationalreview.com/uncommonknowledge/post/?q=NWM5NmUwYmYwYzBhYWJlNmI0MDgxNmQ0ZmEyOTBhMzM="
http://tv.nationalreview.com/uncommonknowledge/post/?q=MmExZTU2NTNiZmU5NTBjZGJiYjBmOGJlZDg0YmU3MTc="

BTW, the interviewer Peter Robinson wrote the line 'tear down this wall' for Reagan.

 

[Zantra]

I was a teenager and I remember seeing the events unfold, and I remember watching the events on TV and everyone talking about them, but I don't have a "moment" like I did withe the Challenger disaster. I remember the challenger disaster better, because I was in elementary school and our class was watching the broadcast on TV.

One silly memory, I can share is that I remember watching the fall of the Berlin wall for the first time, not on CNN, but on Alvin and the Chipmunks- almost like a prediction, 9 months before it happend:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rk_sS1eEL7k&feature=related

Kind of freaked me out when it actually happened. It was a political statement, but at the time it seemed like Alvin knew something the rest of us didn't.

 

[Borek]

it surprises me that you don't see this one as having more significance. Poland was one of many battlefields in the cold war and those incidents you listed were some skirmishes, but Berlin was the main front in the war.

As DanP wrote - fall of Berlin Wall makes a perfect symbol, but this is one of the last domino pieces that fell down. For me that's more capitulation of Eastern Germany officials faced by overhelming evidence that they will be not able to hold their political position, than anything else.

Besides, calling Berlin the main front of the cold war is an exagerration. As you have stated all important events that were listed in this thread took place in other countries of the Eastern block, none in GDR. This was guerilla war without the main front.

I think it can beinteresting to compare DanP memories with mine. In November 1989 - from the economical point of view - there was probably not much difference between Poland ond Romania (well, differences were huge, but let's summarize it saying that in both countries buying even basic stuff was very difficult). However, we were over half a year after Round Table Agreement and 5 months after first free elections since WWII (see Contract Sejm) in which trurly independent candidates were allowed to start (not for all seats, but nonetheless this was a substantial change; thus for us 4th June 1989 is much more prominent date than 9th November). Romania was still in fear, Poland was already in hope. For us in Poland it was obvious that system is falling, and Berlin was just a next step on the ladder.

When speaking of significant moments that we remember of 1989 - two moments come to mind. I remember first days of first session of Contract Sejm - I was demolishing an old shed listening to the radio and it was incredible to hear unthinkable things said loud and ofiicially. And I remember December events in Romania - we were at winter vacations and we were watching news every day, I remember footage from Timişoara (especially someone kicking lying body, I feel pain up to today when I think of it) and later of Ceauşescu trial and execution.

Berlin I remember more as a disappointment - Kohl was with a visit in Poland, talking with Mazowiecki, and left earlier - than as an important event (my personal feelings were that Kohl dared to leave prematurely just because the Berlin wall was falling; obviously biased point of view, but that's how I remember my reaction). System was falling appart, it was just a matter of order - who is next?

 

[DanP]

Suffice to say, one has different perceptions over an event. It's pretty different when you have to live the events (obviously, I am not speaking about directly experiencing Berlin fall), then watching speeches on TV and reading the media. It's normal, and I think it's great. It makes up for diversity.

One thing I always found funny on internet is the bull spit out by many smart-asses who label people bigot leftists, idiot leftists and so on, without knowing anything of the background of the person they categorize, and how much many people from Eastern Europe hates what left and communist doctrine did to us.

I guess when you grow up in a safe heaven you have a lot of time to waste with "textobook" platitudes. Its always easy for those "armchair quarterbacks" to open their mouth.

 

[Andre]

It appears that the tumbling wall had been predicted fairy accurately:

Twenty years ago, on November 9, 1989, the Berlin Wall came down, and with it fell the Soviet Union and its empire of tyranny throughout Eastern Europe. In August 1977, the British journalist and broadcaster Bernard Levin had predicted what eventually happened. ... cont'd

and from the article:

..There will be no gunfire in the streets, no barricades, no general strikes, no hanging of oppressors from lamp-posts, no sacking and burning of government offices, no seizure of radio stations or mass defections among the military...

..And when it does happen—let us suppose, for neatness’ sake, on July 14, 1989—..

...How much the greatest event it is that ever happened in the world! And how much the best!

 

[mheslep]

As DanP wrote - fall of Berlin Wall makes a perfect symbol, but this is one of the last domino pieces that fell down. For me that's more capitulation of Eastern Germany officials faced by overhelming evidence that they will be not able to hold their political position, than anything else.

Besides, calling Berlin the main front of the cold war is an exagerration. As you have stated all important events that were listed in this thread took place in other countries of the Eastern block, none in GDR. This was guerilla war without the main front.

...

Czech President Klaus voices a similar view in the interview above - he cites Solidarity in Poland as the only effective dissident movement in Eastern Europe.

 

[DanP]

Out of curiosity, was symbolism associated with Berlin wall used intensively by USA propaganda during cold war ?

I would think so, but if anyone is kind enough to confirm or deny , please do so