Calculating Thrust and Work for a Vinegar and Baking Soda Rocket

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around calculating thrust and work for a vinegar and baking soda rocket, focusing on the chemical reaction that produces CO2 gas. Participants explore the physics involved in using a 2-L soda bottle as a rocket and seek appropriate equations for thrust and work calculations.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Technical explanation
  • Debate/contested
  • Homework-related

Main Points Raised

  • One participant mentions having performed calculations based on stoichiometric amounts of vinegar and baking soda to produce CO2 and seeks simple equations for thrust and work.
  • Another participant suggests that using a reaction mass like water could improve efficiency, indicating that direct CO2 exhaust is inefficient.
  • A different participant proposes that the products of the reaction, such as sodium acetate and water, could serve as the reaction mass.
  • Some participants express uncertainty about the suitability of using sodium acetate as a reaction mass.
  • One participant requests a straightforward equation for calculating thrust.
  • A later reply provides a thrust equation involving mass flow rate and velocity, while noting that gas as a reaction mass may require a more complex analysis due to compression effects.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants do not reach a consensus on the best approach for calculating thrust and work, with multiple competing views on the use of reaction mass and the efficiency of CO2 exhaust.

Contextual Notes

Participants express uncertainty regarding the assumptions behind their calculations and the efficiency of different reaction masses. There is also mention of potential inefficiencies and the need for a more detailed analysis in certain cases.

alchemistf9
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I am a high school teacher attempting to give my students a project for designing a rocket powered by the chemical reaction between acetic acid and baking soda to produce CO2 gas.

I have done some simple calculations based on stoichiometric amounts of vinegar and acetic to produce a stoichiometric amount of CO2. I then have taken the moles of gas produced and solved for the pressure produced using the ideal gas law equation.

The calculations are attached in the Excel file.

Now I come to the troubling part. The students will be using a 2-L soda bottle as their rocket.

As the physics part of the project I would like to the students to calculate many things:

Fthrust and work done by the gas.

What are the simplest equations to use to calculate Fthrust and Work ?

I've attempted to make several equations which give me some very non-sensible results.
 

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Do you plan to use some reaction mass, like water? A direct CO2 exhaust is quite inefficient. There are several threads about rockets in the forums (at least one of them is in the "Similar Threads" list below).
 
I think the products, sodium acetate and water, or simply sodium acetate solution can act as the reaction mass right?
 
I'm not sure if that is a good idea...
 
The reaction mass is the whole thing yes.
 
I just need a simple equation for the force of Thrust
 
##F=\frac{dm}{dt}v \approx \rho A v^2## where A is the area of the nozzle, rho is the density and v is the velocity there. Neglecting compression and inefficiencies, ##\rho v^2 = 2 \Delta p## with the pressure difference inside/outside. For gas as reaction mass (bad), compression is relevant, of course, so it might need a better analysis.
 

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