Can Virtual Electrons Really Just Pop in and Out of Existence?

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Discussion Overview

The discussion centers around the concept of virtual electrons and their behavior, particularly in relation to the conservation of matter and energy. Participants explore the implications of electrons appearing and disappearing, as well as the nature of their existence in different contexts, such as within molecules like H2O.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Debate/contested
  • Conceptual clarification

Main Points Raised

  • One participant questions how the popping in and out of existence of electrons relates to the conservation of matter, suggesting that electrons cannot simply disappear.
  • Another participant asserts that electrons and positrons can appear and disappear, emphasizing that conservation of matter is not applicable, but conservation of energy and electric charge is maintained.
  • A different viewpoint suggests that the phrase "pops in and out of existence" may not accurately describe the behavior of electrons, proposing that they exist even when not observed.
  • Some participants clarify that the discussion is specifically about virtual electrons, which are said to emerge alongside positrons.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express differing views on the nature of virtual electrons and their implications for conservation laws. There is no consensus on the accuracy of describing electrons as "popping in and out of existence," and the relationship between this phenomenon and conservation principles remains contested.

Contextual Notes

Some assumptions about the definitions of conservation laws and the nature of virtual particles may not be fully articulated, leading to potential misunderstandings in the discussion.

omega-centauri
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I am not sure if this is the right place to post this, so please let me know...?

If electrons pop in and out of existence, how does that relate to the law of the conservation of matter? The electrons can't just disappear. Are the electrons just visiting the other element in the molecule? Like with H2O is the electron not popping in and out of existence but not always with the hydrogen atom because sometimes it is with the oxygen atom?

Thank you!
OC
 
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Yes, electrons and positrons can just appear and disappear. There is no such thing as conservation of matter. What you do have is conservation of energy and electric charge but both of these are conserved by the virtual electron-positron pair production you're talking about.
 
I'm not sure saying the electron "pops in and out of existence" is quite accurate. It will certainly be in a different place whenever you measure it, but I would think it exists even when it isn't being observed.
 
Drakkith, they are talking about virtual electrons that do indeed pop out of nowhere (along with a positron).
 
dauto said:
Drakkith, they are talking about virtual electrons that do indeed pop out of nowhere (along with a positron).

Ah, that would make sense now, wouldn't it?
 

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