Characteristic linear dimension (Reynolds' number)

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the selection of the characteristic linear dimension for calculating Reynolds' number in the context of a diffusion problem within a rectangular pipe. Participants explore different approaches to defining this dimension based on the geometry of the system and the nature of the flow.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Technical explanation
  • Debate/contested

Main Points Raised

  • Some participants suggest using the diameter of the pipe as the characteristic linear dimension, while others propose using 4A/P, depending on the specific conditions of the flow.
  • One participant notes that if the pipe is short, the axial distance should be used in conjunction with the solution for a flat plate due to developing velocity and concentration profiles.
  • Another participant argues for using 4A/P but questions which surface area should be considered for A and P, leading to a discussion about the cross-sectional area of the pipe versus the area of the organic compound.
  • There is a contention regarding the relevance of the cross-sectional area in calculating mass transfer coefficients, with some participants emphasizing its importance for approximating gas flow effects.
  • Participants express uncertainty about the definitions and approximations involved in these calculations, with one questioning why certain definitions are used in the context of turbulent flow.
  • One participant mentions the need for experimental correlations or computational fluid dynamics (CFD) to accurately determine dimensionless behavior in turbulent flow scenarios.
  • Another participant admits to a lack of familiarity with dimensionless forms of differential equations, indicating a gap in understanding that may affect their ability to engage with the topic fully.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants do not reach a consensus on the appropriate characteristic linear dimension to use for calculating Reynolds' number, with multiple competing views and approaches presented throughout the discussion.

Contextual Notes

Limitations include the dependence on specific definitions and the unresolved nature of the mathematical steps involved in applying the discussed methods. The discussion also highlights the need for further exploration of dimensionless forms of equations in fluid dynamics.

dRic2
How can I choose the characteristic linear dimension? For example in pipe it is its diameter, but on a surface is the length, on a flat plane it can be measured as 4A/P. I was having problems determining the characteristic linear dimension for a diffusion problem in a "rectangular" pipe. I don't know if I have to use the length L or 4A/P.

Here's the picture of the problem
 

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What is the precise problem you are trying to solve?
 
Looking at the picture I've uploaded the blue part is an organic compound. Air is forced to flow stationary into the system (like a pipe). The aim is to erase the organic compound by forced convection. When I try to calculate Reynlods' number and then Sherwood I'm not sure about the characteristic dimension...
 
dRic2 said:
Looking at the picture I've uploaded the blue part is an organic compound. Air is forced to flow stationary into the system (like a pipe). The aim is to erase the organic compound by forced convection. When I try to calculate Reynlods' number and then Sherwood I'm not sure about the characteristic dimension...
If the pipe is fairly short, then the velocity- and concentration profiles within the pipe are going to be developing over the length of the pipe, and this approximates boundary layer development over a flat plate, so you would use the axial distance in conjunction with the solution for a flat plate. If the pipe is long compared to the entrance length required to develop the velocity- and concentration profiles (and the flow is turbulent), I would use 4A/P in calculating the pressure drop, the concentration change, and the mass transfer coefficient at the liquid interface.
 
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Chestermiller said:
I would use 4A/P

But what surface are you referring to when you calculate A and P? The "blue" one or the section of the pipe?
 
dRic2 said:
But what surface are you referring to when you calculate A and P? The "blue" one or the section of the pipe?
The cross sectional area and perimeter of the pipe minus the blue.
 
Can I ask you why? Because the diffusion takes place along the internal area of the pipe thus I don't get the meaning of considering the cross sectional area...
 
dRic2 said:
Can I ask you why? Because the diffusion takes place along the internal area of the pipe thus I don't get the meaning of considering the cross sectional area...
This is how the take into account the gas flow to get the mass transfer coefficient at the liquid interface. It is only an approximation, but is about the best you you are going to do without using CFD.
 
is it sort of a definition? I know it is an approximation, but i don't get why it has been defined this way
 
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dRic2 said:
is it sort of a definition? I know it is an approximation, but i don't get why it has been defined this way
It is specified in whatever way seems appropriate to the system at hand. If you have the actual partial differential equations that apply to your system, you can reduce the equations to dimensionless form and determine all the dimensionless groups that apply, including Reynolds number. Then you can solve the equations in dimensionless form. However, if the flow is turbulent, you need to determine the dimensionless behavior experimentally (or use CFD, with turbulent flow capabilities), or find appropriate experimental correlations for your particular situation (or a similar system) in the literature.
 
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  • #11
I'm not familiar with dimensionless forms of differential equation like Navier-Stockes (actually I skipped that paragraph in my book... :frown:). I guess I'll go back and study it again. Thank you
 
  • #12
dRic2 said:
I'm not familiar with dimensionless forms of differential equation like Navier-Stockes (actually I skipped that paragraph in my book... :frown:). I guess I'll go back and study it again. Thank you
There is a general methodology from reducing sets of model equations for a system to dimensionless form. Look up Hellums and Churchill.
 
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