Conductor Bundles: Reduce Impedance Per Meter

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the concept of conductor bundles in power transmission lines, specifically focusing on how they reduce impedance per meter. Participants explore the underlying principles, mathematical relationships, and implications of using bundled conductors compared to single conductors, touching on aspects of electrostatics and electromagnetic theory.

Discussion Character

  • Technical explanation
  • Conceptual clarification
  • Debate/contested

Main Points Raised

  • One participant questions the calculations and variables presented on a referenced page about conductor bundles, seeking clarification on terms like 'potential' and 'equivalent radius'.
  • Another participant notes that bundled conductors are typically used at much higher voltages (e.g., 345 kV) than the 120V AC mentioned, suggesting that a thicker single conductor would increase corona losses due to a higher volts/meter gradient.
  • It is proposed that the skin effect in AC current suggests that a hollow cylinder would be an ideal conductor profile, and that using multiple conductors arranged in a triangle can approximate this shape, potentially improving performance.
  • A participant draws parallels between conductor bundles and radio antennas, explaining that the electrostatic radius is greater for a cage configuration, which reduces corona discharge and increases capacitance per unit length.
  • Discussion includes the idea that shared currents among conductors in a cage configuration lead to reduced magnetic coupling and lower self-inductance per unit length.
  • Mathematical relationships are presented, such as the characteristic impedance of a transmission line, indicating that using a cage configuration can lower impedance due to changes in inductance and capacitance.
  • Another participant references Gauss' law and provides equations related to electric field flux density and potential, suggesting a theoretical framework for understanding the behavior of bundled conductors.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express various viewpoints and hypotheses regarding the behavior and advantages of conductor bundles, with no clear consensus reached on specific calculations or interpretations of the principles involved.

Contextual Notes

Some participants express uncertainty about the definitions and implications of certain terms and equations, indicating that assumptions may be missing or that the discussion relies on specific interpretations of electrostatic and electromagnetic principles.

chopficaro
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http://www.kabculus.com/capacitance-and-inductance-matrices/node7.html
this short page describes conductor bundles, which are power transmission lines hung parallel to each other. i think the page is trying to explain why, when they are hung that way that they reduce impedance per meter, but i don't get it. i understand all the variables they are using except what it is they are calculating.
r is an approximation for the radius of the conductors' cross section (i think)
R is how far away the cables are hung from the center of the bundle (i think)
e0 is the permeability of free space

potential? that means voltage right? why are they using the greek letter for angle? why isn't it 120v rms?
and what is a2 and a4? equivalent radius?
 
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You mention 120V AC, but bundled conductor power lines are used at 345 KV or higher. Shift your horizon a whole lot.

If we used a single but thicker conductor, the volts/meter gradient would be higher. That increases corona losses.

You also should think of the skin effect. AC current tends to run on the outside of the conductor. i.e. the skin. So the ideal profile would be a hollow cylinder, not a solid wire. But 3 conductors in a triangle shape, approximate a hollow cylinder. Even more conductors, the better the approximation.
 
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chopficaro said:
i think the page is trying to explain why, when they are hung that way that they reduce impedance per meter, but i don't get it.
The same technique is used for radio antennas where they are called cage lines, or cage dipoles.

The electrostatic radius is greater for a cage than for a single wire. That reduces corona discharge, but it also increases the capacitance per unit length to other bundles and to ground.

Because the currents are shared by the conductors of the cage, those currents are further apart than they would be on a single conductor, so there is less magnetic coupling of the currents. That reduces the self inductance per unit length of the cage.

The characteristic impedance of a transmission line, Zo = √ ( L / C ). When using a cage, L is reduced, and C is increased, so the impedance of a line, or a dipole over ground, will be lower than that of a single wire.

Another advantage of a cage for dipole elements is that the radius can be reduced in the element as it approaches a conductive tower or supporting structure. That reduces impedance changes along the element, so it reduces losses and raises the Q of the dipole.
 
According to Electrostatics Theory the surface integral around an electric charge Q of the electric field flux density D it is equal to this charge [Gauss' law].D=ε.E where E it is the electric field [intensity].
So ε.E*2.п.r.length=Q or E(r)=Q/(2.п.ε)/r/length
The electric potential[aka voltage] V=ʃE.dr=Q/(2.п.ε).ln(r2/r1) per unit length.
The Green function it seems to be the potential per unit length and unit charge.
For bundled parallel wires see the link-for instance:
http://users.ece.utexas.edu/~baldick/classes/369/Lecture_6.ppt
 

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