Confusion about tidal locking and rotational kinetic energy

In summary: So, in summary, the rotating bar has more energy/angular momentum, but this is not the case for the Earth-Moon system as I need to consider both bodies, and it's better for the system to stay locked to avoid giving more angular momentum to the Earth because the Earth would contribute disproportionally to the total kinetic energy if given more angular momentum. Thanks for your help!
  • #1
arestes
80
3
Hello!
I was reading two things:

1) tidal locking (as explained in the Wikipedia article:https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tidal_locking

Tidal_locking_of_the_Moon_with_the_Earth.gif


where it is stated that, because of internal friction caused by the body of water being attracted to the moon and deforming, the kinetic energy of the system Earth-Moon diminishes as time passes, giving rise to tidal locking. This explains why the left figure above has less kinetic energy and is the final state of the system after some time. This makes sense.2) Chabay and Sherwood's not-so-popular but (I believe) well thought-out book "Matter and Interactions". Here, they split Kinetic energy into Rotational and Translational. They put up two examples in which a bar (with two small spheres) is rotated about a point, by virtue of a light rod. See figures 11.81 and 11.82. Figure 11.81 shows the bar rotating in such a way that its orientation remains fixed (vertical) while rotating around the central point. The other figure shows the bar rotating around the bar's own center and while this very center rotates around the original center. The first one (11.81) is said to have less angular momentum than 11.82 because 11.81 has no "intrinsic" rotation about its own axis. I assume that this argument also shows that the first (bar with unchanging orientation) has less kinetic energy.

11.81.jpg
11.82.jpg


But... this contradicts the wikipedia article that requires that the rigid body rotating lose energy and starts showing the same face to the center (the Earth), which means its orientation keeps changing.

What am I getting wrong?

Any help would be appreciated.
 

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  • #2
arestes said:
What am I getting wrong?
You need to consider both the angular momentum and the energy of both the Earth and the moon.

Stopping the rotation of the moon would make it have less energy, but also less angular momentum. That reduced angular momentum would need to go into the earth, which would require a substantially larger increase of KE.

Also, even if that configuration had less energy there would be no way to get to it.
 
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  • #3
I see. So, if I understand correctly:

Chabay- Sherwood is right and the rotating bar does have more energy/angular momentum.
However, this is not the case for the Earth-Moon system as I need to consider both bodies, and it's better for the system to stay locked to avoid giving more angular momentum to the Earth because the Earth would contribute disproportionally to the total kinetic energy if given more angular momentum.(by looking at the formulas of kinetic energy as a function of angular speed squared as opposed to angular momentum which depends on angular speed only). Am I right?

One more question, please: I'm trying to see how being locked minimizes the energy of the Earth-Moon system while conserving the angular momentum. It should be the case that in this locked state, energy remains constant, right? Can this be proven easily? I also read that there are "resonances" for this locking mechanism such as in the case of Mercury and the Sun (3:2). This makes me believe this is not very simple. Any pointers as to how this is proved?
Thanks
 
  • #4
Dale said:
Stopping the rotation of the moon would make it have less energy, but also less angular momentum. That reduced angular momentum would need to go into the earth, which would require a substantially larger increase of KE.

A part of the angular momentum goes into the orbital angular momentum, increasing the distance and therefore the potential energy of the system. This will also reduce the orbital kinetic energy of the moon but that doesn't outweight the increase of the potential energy (due to the virial theorem).
 

1. What is tidal locking?

Tidal locking is a phenomenon in which the same side of a celestial body, such as a planet or moon, always faces its orbiting partner. This is caused by the gravitational pull of the larger body on the smaller one, creating a bulge on the side closest to the larger body. Over time, this bulge causes the smaller body to rotate at the same rate as its orbit, resulting in the same side always facing the larger body.

2. How does tidal locking affect the rotational kinetic energy of a celestial body?

Tidal locking affects the rotational kinetic energy of a celestial body by reducing its rotational speed. As the smaller body becomes tidally locked, its rotation slows down until it becomes equal to its orbital period. This results in a decrease in the body's rotational kinetic energy, as the velocity of rotation is a key factor in calculating this energy.

3. Can tidal locking occur between any two celestial bodies?

Yes, tidal locking can occur between any two celestial bodies that have a gravitational interaction. This includes planets and their moons, as well as binary star systems. However, the degree of tidal locking may vary depending on the mass and distance between the bodies.

4. Is tidal locking permanent?

In most cases, tidal locking is considered permanent as it takes a significant amount of time for a body's rotation to slow down and become tidally locked. However, in some cases, external forces such as collisions or gravitational perturbations from other bodies can disrupt the tidal locking and cause the body to rotate at a different rate.

5. How does tidal locking impact the habitability of a planet?

Tidal locking can have a significant impact on the habitability of a planet. If a planet is tidally locked to its star, one side of the planet will always face the star, resulting in extreme temperature differences between the two sides. This can make it difficult for life to exist on the planet, as the extreme temperatures can make it challenging for organisms to survive. However, some studies suggest that tidal locking may also have some benefits for habitability, such as stabilizing a planet's climate and promoting the development of life-supporting environments.

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