Deriving Elastica Equation: Bernoulli/Newton

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Discussion Overview

The discussion centers around deriving the elastica equation using concepts from Bernoulli's and Newton's principles. Participants explore the mathematical relationships between curvature, angle, and arclength in the context of a curve described by a function y = y(x).

Discussion Character

  • Mathematical reasoning
  • Technical explanation
  • Homework-related

Main Points Raised

  • One participant presents the elastica equation in terms of curvature and seeks to derive it from a given relationship involving the angle θ and arclength ds.
  • Another participant suggests a series of steps to find θ(x) and relates it to the derivatives of y with respect to x.
  • Further contributions involve manipulating trigonometric identities and applying the chain rule to relate the derivatives of y to the curvature.
  • One participant expresses difficulty in following the outlined steps, indicating a need for clarification on the relationships between sin(θ), cos(θ), and tan(θ).
  • A later reply clarifies that the slope of the curve can be expressed in terms of the tangent of the angle θ, leading to a differentiation that connects the second derivative of y to the curvature expression.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants do not reach a consensus on the derivation process, as some express confusion while others provide clarifications. The discussion remains unresolved regarding the complete derivation of the elastica equation.

Contextual Notes

Participants rely on various assumptions about the relationships between derivatives and trigonometric functions, and there are unresolved steps in the derivation process that may depend on specific interpretations of the equations involved.

hushish
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Hi,

Bernoulli's/Newton's classic elastica equation is of the form:

1) curvature = dθ/ds

The RHS reforms to the well known elastica equation:

2) d2y/d2x/(1+(dy/dx)2)3/2

How do I get from 1) to 2)?

Regards,
 
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Hi there.

Your function has the form y=y(x).

Step 1. Find a formula for theta(x), the angle made by the tangent vector at point x.

Step 2. ds is the element of arclength. The Pythagorean thereom says that ds^2=dx^2+dy^2. Now do the algebra to solve for ds / dx and don't let your Intro Calc. professor see you treating differentials as if they were numbers subject to the normal algebraic rules.

Step 3. Use the Chain rule for differentiation.

Cheers
 
Thanks Vargo,

Help me out here. If I follow the steps you outline I get stuck:

1)ds= √dy2+dx2

2)sinθ=dy/√dy2+dx2

3)cosθ=dx/√dy2+dx2

4)1/ρ=dθ/ds

5)dsinθ/ds=cosθ.dθ/ds=cosθ/ρ

Now I'm stuck...
 
You have sin(theta) and cos(theta). What is tan(theta) as a function of x? Then take the arctan and you have theta(x).
 
Still no luck I'm afraid Vargo...
 
Alrighty,

Let P be a point in the plane with polar angle theta. Then tan(theta) represents the slope of the line connecting the origin to P. Similarly, the slope of any line is equal to the tangent of the polar angle of that line. In particular, if we have a curve y(x), then
y'(x) = tan(theta), where theta is the angle of the tangent line.

Therefore, theta = arctan(y'). We differentiate with respect to x and use the chain rule:
d theta / dx = y'' / (1+ (y')^2)

Now we know that ds/dx = sqrt( 1 +(y')^2 ), so using the Chain rule again, we find

d theta / ds = [y'' / (1+ (y')^2)]*[1 / sqrt( 1 +(y')^2 )] = y'' / (1 + (y') )^(3/2).
 
Brilliant-now I see it! Thanks a million Vargo.
 

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