Different answers from equation of continuity and Bernoulli

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the apparent contradiction between the equation of continuity and Bernoulli's equation in the context of fluid flow through a sink wand with adjustable flow speeds. Participants explore how changes in cross-sectional area affect flow velocity and pressure, considering both theoretical frameworks.

Discussion Character

  • Debate/contested
  • Technical explanation
  • Conceptual clarification

Main Points Raised

  • One participant describes using the equation of continuity, suggesting that decreasing the cross-sectional area of the wand increases flow velocity, assuming constant flow rate.
  • Another participant applies Bernoulli's equation, arguing that if the pressure difference (ΔP) is positive, the velocity at the outlet (v2) must be greater than at the inlet (v1).
  • A different perspective suggests that the pressure drop at the outlet of the wand must be considered, indicating that the geometry of the pipe influences the results and that state 2 should be inside the wand where fluid remains pressurized.
  • One participant emphasizes that the pressure at the reservoir is not relevant since the velocity there is near zero, highlighting the importance of pressure changes at the wand opening where velocity changes occur.
  • Another participant challenges the initial reasoning by stating that while the cross-sectional area decreases, the exit velocity remains unchanged for an inviscid fluid according to Bernoulli's equation, leading to a decrease in volumetric flow rate.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express differing views on the relationship between pressure, velocity, and cross-sectional area, with no consensus reached on how these factors interact in the context of the sink wand. The discussion remains unresolved regarding the implications of each equation in this scenario.

Contextual Notes

Assumptions regarding fluid properties (e.g., inviscid vs. viscous) and the specific conditions at the wand's outlet are not fully explored, leading to potential limitations in the arguments presented.

Alexander83
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Hi there,
So I was doing the dishes this morning using a sink wand hat can toggle between different flow speeds. The way that I've always thought of this working is using the equation of continuity:

Volume flow rate: = Area*velocity

Pressing a button on the wand decreases the cross-sectional area and correspondingly increases the flow velocity assuming that the flow rate is constant.

The issue that I'm running into is trying to simultaneously explain this with Bernoulli's equation:

P1 + pgy1 + 1/2pv12 = P2 + pgy2 + 1/2pv22 =

I'll take state 1 to be at the water reservoir or wherever the water in the pipes is pressurized and 2 to be at the outlet of the wand. I'm assuming that pressing the button on the wand does not change the pressure at the reservoir (nor at the outlet of the wand, where it is subject to atmospheric pressure).

Based on Bernoulli's equation, this would suggest that pressing the wand button should have NO effect on the flow velocity, which contradicts the result from the equation of motion. So: what am I missing here. I feel like I may be incorrect in my pressure assumption above somehow.

Thanks!

Chris
 
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Let's assume that y1 = y2 to simplify a bit. The Bernoulli equation gives
##v_2^2 - v_1^2 = 2\Delta P/ \rho##, (##\Delta P = P_1-P_2##).
Now ##\Delta P > 0##, therefore ##v_2 > v_1##.
 
Alexander83 said:
I'll take state 1 to be at the water reservoir or wherever the water in the pipes is pressurized and 2 to be at the outlet of the wand. I'm assuming that pressing the button on the wand does not change the pressure at the reservoir (nor at the outlet of the wand, where it is subject to atmospheric pressure).

According to your reasoning the geometry of the pipe doesn't play a role so whatever geometry you chose for the pipe you will get the same result. I don't think so. At the outlet of the wand there is a huge pressure-drop so I think you have to take state 2 to be inside the wand where the fluid is still pressurized. Now if you use Bernoulli equation you will see that a change in the section will affect pressure and velocity.
 
Alexander83 said:
pressing the button on the wand does not change the pressure at the reservoir
Actually, hat doesn't matter: in the reservoir the velocity is near zero. What matters is the pressure before and after the wand opening -- there, where the velocity changes.
 
Alexander83 said:
Hi there,
So I was doing the dishes this morning using a sink wand hat can toggle between different flow speeds. The way that I've always thought of this working is using the equation of continuity:

Volume flow rate: = Area*velocity

Pressing a button on the wand decreases the cross-sectional area and correspondingly increases the flow velocity assuming that the flow rate is constant.
This is the flaw in your logic. Cranking down on the wand reduces the cross sectional area, but does not reduce the velocity at the exit ( at least not for an inviscid fluid, according to the Bernoulli equation). So the exit velocity is unchanged. But the velocity times area (the volumetric flow rate) decreases.
 
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