Do you take Tyelenol or Advil/Motrin?

[Tsu]

If you have a queasy stomach, this might not be the thread for you. But if you routinely take large doses of these meds or are thinking of 'offing' yourself with them (PLEASE don't be considering this - I only mention it because of the story I am about to relate), then buck up and read on.

In case some of you don't know it, I am a CT/Xray Technologist on an evening shift and work mainly out of the emergency room. On Thursday night we received a young woman in her early to mid 30's as an "overdose". She was in pretty rough shape. Mentally somewhat with it, but her kidneys were producing urine that was very dark and reddish in color. Her lab work indicated that she was in kidney and liver failure. She was becoming septic (bacterias that are filtered out through her urine are now traveling through her bloodstream). Her abdomen was EXTREMELY tender to the touch. Through more lab work and investigation it was discovered that she had overdosed on Tyelenol. She is still, today, in the ICU dying a slow and very painful death. There is nothing we can do for her but try to manage her pain - very difficult to do in this situation.

Sorry to be so morbid, but it has been a TERRIBLE week at work. I just really wanted everyone I care about to know what overuse (or overdose) of these meds can really do. I know that most people who take these meds know of the warnings of kidney and/or liver problems with overuse, but not many know that this is one of the worst ways to die imaginable. Please, pay attention to your dosing with these medications.

Thank you very much. :shy:

 

[tribdog]

When my leg was hurting really bad I was taking about 20-30 Advil a day.

 

[Moonbear]

Tsu, was that an intentional overdose, or accidental? How many Tylenol do you need to take to overdose like that?!

I don't bother much with acetaminophen. It never seems to do a thing for me. Though, if I have a fever and just want to get the fever down, then it's useful, but how often do you have a fever and no other symptoms that require more than just a fever reducer?

I do use ibuprofen, but try to limit that too. I never take more than three 200 mg tablets. If that doesn't get rid of my headache, it means it's time to take a hot shower and crawl into bed.

But, you know, if I was going to off myself (not that I would), I don't think Tylenol would be the first thing to cross my mind as something to overdose on!

 

[spender]

I don't know but women tend to way overmedicate, I'm a 38year old guy and took only pills for my tooth ache after root canal, that is all, otherwise if I have headache i just go to bed.Sleep is the best medicine.

 

[Tsu]

When my leg was hurting really bad I was taking about 20-30 Advil a day.

I really hope you're not serious, trib. But - :grumpy: I'm not talking to you until you apologize for not FREAKIN' ANSWERING MY PM WHEN I WAS SO WORRIED ABOUT YOU!111 :grumpy: :tongue2:

 

[tribdog]

I really hope you're not serious, trib. But - :grumpy: I'm not talking to you until you apologize for not FREAKIN' ANSWERING MY PM WHEN I WAS SO WORRIED ABOUT YOU!111 :grumpy: :tongue2:

I had about 20 PMs. I posted in General Discussion as soon as I got online, thought it would be okay. I apologize for not answering the PM

 

[Moonbear]

I had about 20 PMs. I posted in General Discussion as soon as I got online, thought it would be okay. I apologize for not answering the PM

LOL! Probably 10 of them were from me trying to shoo him off to the doctor.

Like Tsu said, you better not be serious about how many Advils you took in a day there! :grumpy:

 

[Tsu]

Tsu, was that an intentional overdose, or accidental? How many Tylenol do you need to take to overdose like that?!

We aren't sure. The words "12 Tyelenol" were spoken by an ER nurse yesterday as we were discussing the case (but I only really believe anything if it's the patient's unit nurse or physician saying it) but neither the patient nor the family knew when or how they were taken. I heard one of the docs say it might have been as long as several days ago since she was already in such bad shape when she came to us. Frequently, the OD's we get are, indeed, unintentional. Ignorance regarding proper dosage is usually to blame. That's why I mentioned paying attention to proper dosage in my original post. DO NOT EXCEED RECOMMENDED DAILY DOSAGE! I know many people do, but they should know that even if they can't feel it, they most likely ARE damaging their organs.

But, you know, if I was going to off myself (not that I would), I don't think Tylenol would be the first thing to cross my mind as something to overdose on!

I would imagine if someone were in enough pain (physical or mental in origin) and not thinking well they might consider it... Especially if that was all they could get their hands on. You'd be surprised some of the ways people choose to end their pain and suffering.

 

[Moonbear]

I don't know but women tend to way overmedicate, I'm a 38year old guy and took only pills for my tooth ache after root canal, that is all, otherwise if I have headache i just go to bed.Sleep is the best medicine.

Watch those generalizations about women there, or you'll have the PF sisterhood showing you what pain really is!

Sleep is good, but some of us have jobs to go to and don't always have the luxury of going to bed when we have a headache.

 

[Tsu]

I had about 20 PMs. I posted in General Discussion as soon as I got online, thought it would be okay. I apologize for not answering the PM

OK. You're forgiven. *pats tribdog's head - slips him a Milk Bone :rofl:*
But, still - you'd better be kidding about the number you took, you dumb f***! Geez!11... You need a KEEPER!11

 

[Moonbear]

OK. You're forgiven. *pats tribdog's head - slips him a Milk Bone :rofl:*
But, still - you'd better be kidding about the number you took, you dumb f***! Geez!11... You need a KEEPER!11

I'm starting to think he needs more than one keeper! This is all starting to seem like far too much work. I can childproof and dogproof the place, and yet tribdogs still seem to find trouble.

 

[Tsu]

Watch those generalizations about women there, or you'll have the PF sisterhood showing you what pain really is!

YES, DEAR! WATCH YOURSELF! We're worse than Pitbulls with lipstick. We're Nuns with Guns! (and other assorted weaponry) :rofl: In fact let me just refer you to the pictures toward the middle of this page:

https://www.physicsforums.com/showthread.php?t=58160&page=25&pp=15

And then, maybe take a look at this thread:

https://www.physicsforums.com/showthread.php?t=59599

:rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl:

 

[Tsu]

spender - Welcome to PF! Don't let us scare you away. We joke around a lot. But, FYI, guys OD just as much as women. They are more prone to using alcohol (BA levels in the toxic ranges), and they use guns more often than women do. But they also OD on pills.

 

[JasonRox]

I never take them ever.

I probably have taken a total of 10 in my lifetime.

I knew a girl from college who took 5 every morning!

 

[spender]

spender - Welcome to PF! Don't let us scare you away. We joke around a lot. But, FYI, guys OD just as much as women. They are more prone to using alcohol (BA levels in the toxic ranges), and they use guns more often than women do. But they also OD on pills.

Thanks Tsu !
Few more words of wisdom.
What can be worse than a woman stuffed with pills and in mids of PMS?
Just kidding :rofl:

 

[Moonbear]

I never take them ever.

I probably have taken a total of 10 in my lifetime.

I knew a girl from college who took 5 every morning!

Every morning?! She did know they aren't vitamins, right?

Back to serious discussion, women do have a higher incidence of migraine headaches than men. This is typically attributed to hormonal factors, though I don't think that's known for certain. Premenstrual migraines are due to hormonal fluctuations, but migraines occur at times other than that.

There had been news reports about rebound headaches from OTC analgesics as well (ibuprofen, acetaminophen and aspirin were all included in that list). It seemed to be like a withdrawal symptom, that those who took OTC analgesics frequently would then get rebound headaches when they stopped taking them. It would take a while of staying away from the analgesics to get rid of the headaches.

 

[Monique]

Another important note: DON'T use Tylenol in combination with alcohol: it lowers the toxicicity level of the drug so that you end up in greater danger of doing liver damage. I once had a whole lecture on the dangers of Tylenol, it's the most common (accidental) overdose they see in hospitals and the symptoms (as tsu said) are not too pretty. That didn't stop me from using it as a medication though, but I'd not take more than 500 mg at a time.

 

[Nereid]

What's wrong with good ol' asprin? Or paracetamol?

 

[Monique]

paracetamol = tylenol the name of the active component in the medication is acetaminophen

 

[Evo]

Like Moonbear, Tylenol doesn't work for me so I use aspirin. Why is Tylenol (acetaminophen) still on the market?

 

[Moonbear]

Like Moonbear, Tylenol doesn't work for me so I use aspirin. Why is Tylenol (acetaminophen) still on the market?

It's a good fever reducer, and the whole marketing strategy (the one hospitals prefer) is based on Tylenol III, which is the prescription form sold with codeine in it as a strong pain-killer anti-inflamatory drug, but the acetaminophen is just reducing the inflammation, while the codeine is doing the heavy duty painkilling.

There are people who are sensitive to aspirin. I think Tylenol just cornered the market for those people back before ibuprofen was available over the counter (Motrin used to be available only by prescription, and has only been available OTC for about 10 years or so). You also can't use aspirin to treat fever in children due to the risk of Reye syndrome.

I have yet to learn of any medication that doesn't have side effects. I think it's best to avoid using them as much as possible. A lot of people feel they should never feel any discomfort at all and start popping pills for the most minor things. I prefer to wait until it's something unbearable, or really interferring with my ability to get my work accomplished.

 

[Evo]

I know about Reyes for children under 14, but there is Ibuprofen. Is acetaminophen the only fever reducing drug that can be taken by someone allergic to aspirin? I've noticed that both Ibuprofen and Naproxen Sodium advise you not to take if you are allergic to aspirin. How common are aspirin allergies? I've never known anyone actually allergic to aspirin.

 

[Astronuc]

We use ibuprofen - 1 at a time, about every 6 hrs, to break a fever in the kids. We had used tylenol in the passed, and one doctor suggested alternating between ibuprofen and tylenol.

My wife uses ibuprofen.

And I use good old aspirin mostly, and occasionally ibuprofen.


Jason, wait till you get past 40. You will probably be taking an analgesic more often, especially if you have few impacts with the ground.

Tsu - I am sorry to hear about the young woman. It is sad to see someone end their life that way, and I know its rough one the medical staff and family who watch it happen.

 

[Tsu]

Thanks, Astronuc. This kind of thing really IS one of the hardest things we have to deal with as medical professionals. We see and deal with so much trauma and death, but some of them just really get to me. This was one of them.

Abused children get to me the most. I always feel like I just want to pick them up and run out and throw them in my car and take them home with me to love them and to keep them safe. It's just sickening to have to x-ray their broken little bodies, knowing that their parents did this to them...

 

[chronon]

Paracetamol (Tyrenol) seems to be the preferred analgesic for those of us with dodgy kidneys. When I was in hospital, they were happy for me to have 2 500mg paracetamol tablets to deal with a high temperature, but ibuprofen is a definite no-no. I'm not sure about aspirin. The article at http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/NSAID seems to class it with ibuprofen in this regard.

 

[Evo]

Sounds more likely your doctor wasn't on the ball?

Tylenol (acetaminophen) causes kidney failure.

According to The New England Journal of Medicine - Conclusions: People who often take acetaminophen or NSAIDs have an increased risk of ESRD (end stage renal disease), but not those who often take aspirin.

http://content.nejm.org/cgi/content/abstract/331/25/1675

I'm surprised they didn't give you aspirin instead.

"A study just released in the New England Journal of Medicine" suggests that 8-10 percent of the 50,000 annual kidney failures in the United States are caused by acetaminophen. A person who takes more than one tablet per day exposes themselves to twice the likelihood of kidney failure."

http://www.chiroweb.com/archives/13/04/04.html

 

[Gokul43201]

I have yet to learn of any medication that doesn't have side effects.

Is that even theoretically possible ? I recently heard something about the harmful side effects of drinking over a liter of water a day.

 

[Nereid]

But surely the real question should be 'what chemicals/drugs/medicines to you react to, and how?' As we know only too well by now, individuals vary a great deal, and their 'drug tolerance' also changes with age ... roll on the 'genetic medicine' era!

Oh, and BTW, isn't aspirin the key ingredient of many a folk medicine, going back possibly to 'African Eve'?

 

[Evo]

Oh, and BTW, isn't aspirin the key ingredient of many a folk medicine, going back possibly to 'African Eve'?

Yes, willow bark contains salicin. Acetylsalicylic acid (aspirin) is the synthetic version.

 

[Monique]

Is that even theoretically possible ? I recently heard something about the harmful side effects of drinking over a liter of water a day.

The way medicine works, is that they first find out the highest tolerable dose and then they find out whether at that dose there is therapeutic action.

Finding out the highest tolerable dose means that there will be side-effects, but that those won't kill you..

 

[Astronuc]

I recently heard something about the harmful side effects of drinking over a liter of water a day.

Where did you hear that?

When I played soccer or worked as an iron worker, I would drink a gallon+ (3.785+ l) of water or Gatorade a day. But then I would sweat that much too.

During a day with an air temperature of 95-100°F (the iron was more like 100-110°F) and 60+% humidity, my body mass would fluctuate about 5-6 lbm (2.3-2.7 kgs).

 

[tribdog]

The big side effect of too much water is drowning.

 

[Andre]

and BTW, isn't aspirin the key ingredient of many a folk medicine, going back possibly to 'African Eve'?

Not only of African Eve. There is also the hypothesis of animals knowing this. My pet mammoth was found with a stomach full of willow leaves, while the normal diet consisted predominantly of grasses (Poceae). Furthermore, the post mortem revealed that this animal may have suffered from pain indeed.