Does a material change the direction of polarization of light?

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Discussion Overview

The discussion centers around the interaction of polarized light with materials, specifically how materials can change the direction of polarization of light. It explores concepts related to radar and millimeter wave applications, including cross-polarization and depolarization, as well as the implications of surface roughness on these phenomena.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Technical explanation
  • Debate/contested

Main Points Raised

  • Some participants describe how unpolarized light can become polarized through interactions such as reflection, scattering, and refraction with materials.
  • One participant provides an example involving dipole antennas and a wire reflector, suggesting that vertically polarized light can be rotated to a 45-degree angle upon reflection.
  • Another participant raises the question of whether vertically polarized light can be reflected as horizontally polarized light, referencing the cross-polarization principle in SAR imaging.
  • There is a discussion about the effects of surface roughness on depolarization and the potential for the electric field of incident light to rotate based on the roughness of the material.
  • Some participants mention the possibility of using cross-polarization measurements to quantify depolarization and relate it to surface characteristics.
  • One participant questions whether the rotation of the electric field polarization can provide insights into the nature of the reflecting material, while another notes the complexity of factors influencing reflection.
  • A participant studying radar microwaves and their interaction with rocks seeks to understand what reflected signals with different polarization states might indicate about substrate roughness or geometry.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

The discussion contains multiple competing views and remains unresolved regarding the specific mechanisms and implications of polarization changes upon interaction with materials. Participants express differing opinions on the factors influencing these interactions and their interpretations.

Contextual Notes

Participants reference various studies and literature on rough surface scattering and depolarization, indicating a depth of analysis in the field. However, there are limitations in the assumptions made about the interactions and the definitions of terms used, which remain unresolved.

Who May Find This Useful

This discussion may be of interest to researchers and practitioners in fields related to optics, radar technology, and materials science, particularly those focused on the interactions of electromagnetic waves with various surfaces.

Shadi Abdelhadi
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The polarization referes to the direction of the electric field of a light wave which is to be one direction. The unpolarized light interacts with a material in various ways such as reflection, scattering, refraction. and each of which can transform an unpolarized light into a vertically or horizontally polarized light with respect to the plane of the material. In co-polarization SAR images, there are certain features that appear VV vertically sent and vertically received images , and other features only appear in HH horizontally sent horizontally received images. Then why the need for cross-polarization systems VH, HV. How can a radar antenna that is adjusted to a vertical polarization axis receive hortizontally polarized reflected echos? How is it even possible for the direction of the electric field to change 45 degrees upon interaction with a certain material
 

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Shadi Abdelhadi said:
How is it even possible for the direction of the electric field to change 45 degrees upon interaction with a certain material
Take a simple example with dipole antennas and a simple wire reflector. Transmit a vertically polarized signal with the vertical dipole, and that EM wave encounters a wire reflector that is set at 45 degrees. That EM excites a current in the wire (less than if it were vertically oriented, but still a substantial current), which then causes EM radiation at that 45 degree angle. So yes, vertically polarized EM radiation can get rotated as part of being reflected -- it happens all the time.
 
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Shadi Abdelhadi said:
Summary:: The cross-polarization principle of SAR imaging says there's an option to transmit vertically polarized echos and receive horizontally polarized echos or vice versa. Is it possible that vertically polarized light can be reflected horizontally polarized

Interesting question- I am familiar with this kind of analysis in radar/millimeter wave applications, but I think it's possible in general by considering s- and p-polarization states, which is set by the orientation of a surface relative to the direction of propagation. I tried to envision a Brewster window doing this but couldn't quite figure it out.

More generally, if the surface is rough and depolarizes incident light (or if a bulk media is turbid and scatters light), cross-polarization measurements can quantify how much depolarization is happening. The references I found online point to wind speed measurements as another application.
 
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So if the surface is non-uniform, may depolarization occur? Or may the electric field of the incident light beam rotate 45 degrees upon interaction with the material based on its degree of roughness. Also, through the cross-polarization state, can we indicate the roughness width, height or the lay direction relative to the polarization direction of the reflected beam. I appreciate your interest.
 
Shadi Abdelhadi said:
So if the surface is non-uniform, may depolarization occur? Or may the electric field of the incident light beam rotate 45 degrees upon interaction with the material based on its degree of roughness. Also, through the cross-polarization state, can we indicate the roughness width, height or the lay direction relative to the polarization direction of the reflected beam. I appreciate your interest.
There's an enormous amount of literature on this subject going back to the 1960's:

@article{bahar1987review,
title={Review of the full wave solutions for rough surface scattering and depolarization: Comparisons with geometric and physical optics, perturbation, and two-scale hybrid solutions},
author={Bahar, Ezekiel},
journal={Journal of Geophysical Research: Oceans},
volume={92},
number={C5},
pages={5209--5224},
year={1987},
publisher={Wiley Online Library}
}

@article{khenchaf2001bistatic,
title={Bistatic scattering and depolarization by randomly rough surfaces: application to the natural rough surfaces in X-band},
author={Khenchaf, Ali},
journal={Waves in random media},
volume={11},
number={2},
pages={61--90},
year={2001},
publisher={Taylor \& Francis}
}

@article{campbell1996lava,
title={Lava flow surface roughness and depolarized radar scattering},
author={Campbell, Bruce A and Shepard, Michael K},
journal={Journal of Geophysical Research: Planets},
volume={101},
number={E8},
pages={18941--18951},
year={1996},
publisher={Wiley Online Library}
}

etc etc etc
 
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berkeman said:
Take a simple example with dipole antennas and a simple wire reflector. Transmit a vertically polarized signal with the vertical dipole, and that EM wave encounters a wire reflector that is set at 45 degrees. That EM excites a current in the wire (less than if it were vertically oriented, but still a substantial current), which then causes EM radiation at that 45 degree angle. So yes, vertically polarized EM radiation can get rotated as part of being reflected -- it happens all the time.

Does the rotation of the electric field polarization give any clues about the nature of the reflecting material?
 
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Shadi Abdelhadi said:
Does the rotation of the electric field polarization give any clues about the nature of the reflecting material?
What do you mean by "nature"? I suppose it might tell you a bit about how conductive the material is that the EM is getting reflected off of, but there are so many other things that affect the reflection (like size of the reflector, shape, roughness, etc.) that it would be hard to single any particular thing out.
 
Well, to be more specific, i study the Radar microwaves and their interactions with rocks, if the type of rock is known by other means, what should the reflected signals, having a different polarization state from the incident signal, indicate about the substrate in terms of roughness or geometry?
 

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