Efficiency of Electrical Conversion

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the efficiency of electrical conversion in a solar energy lab experiment. Participants explore various configurations of a solar power system, focusing on power flows, measurements, and the theoretical understanding of efficiency calculations. The conversation includes technical details about circuit setups and the roles of different components such as batteries and inverters.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Technical explanation
  • Conceptual clarification
  • Debate/contested

Main Points Raised

  • One participant describes their lab setup and the calculations for overall efficiency based on different operational modes of the solar power system.
  • Questions arise regarding the meaning of negative current readings in certain configurations, with a request for clarification on the definitions of "discharging" and "consumption."
  • Another participant expresses confusion over the terminology used, suggesting that it may contribute to misunderstandings about the system's operation.
  • Clarifications are provided about the roles of the solar panel, battery, and inverter in different operational states, with some participants proposing alternative interpretations of the terms used.
  • A later reply emphasizes the importance of understanding the flow of power in the system and suggests a method for calculating efficiency based on inputs and outputs.
  • Participants discuss the need for clearer diagrams and explanations to facilitate understanding of the experimental setup and results.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express various interpretations of the system's operation and terminology, indicating that multiple competing views remain. The discussion does not reach a consensus on the definitions and implications of the measurements taken.

Contextual Notes

Participants note limitations in their understanding due to unclear terminology and the absence of certain measurements, such as irradiance, which could affect the interpretation of efficiency. The discussion reflects a reliance on the definitions provided by the original poster, which some participants find confusing.

Who May Find This Useful

This discussion may be useful for individuals interested in solar energy systems, electrical engineering, and efficiency calculations in experimental setups. It may also benefit those looking to understand the complexities of power flow in renewable energy applications.

says
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I completed a solar energy lab, where we looked at power flows, which were represented through different parts of a circuit measured with 3 separate ammeters. We used four different modes and varied the irradiance and load.

only charging = energy from solar panel to circuit without battery switched on
charging + consumption = " " + battery switched on
discharging + consumption = some lights from solar panel switched off + battery switched on
only discharging = battery + solar panel switched off

I've had to calculate the overall efficiency of each setup too and have done so by:
[ (dis)charging + consumption ] / [ PV Power + (dis) charging ] = overall efficiency

I've attached the results to this thread, but I don't understand much about them and haven't been given any information about the theory behind it. If anyone could either point me in the direction of some literature, or help me answer the questions I have below I would very much appreciate it. Then I could interpret the data a bit better. :)

1) Why are only 2/4 (dis)charging results negative? The negative was a result of the current being negative, but I don't understand why 'only charging' and 'charging+consumption' had negative current, and 'discharging+consumption' and 'only discharging' had a positive current.

2) Is the overall efficiency different for each setup because of the battery using power generated by the solar panel? And because we changed the irradiance of the cell by switching some cells off?
 

Attachments

  • Efficiency of electrical Conversion.jpg
    Efficiency of electrical Conversion.jpg
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Could you post a diagram of your setup, including the power measurement components? Also, what is the difference between "discharging" and "consumption"? Is discharging just self-discharging of the battery?
 
Your terminology is counter-intuitive and confuses me. Is it possible that is the source of your uncertainty as well ?
says said:
only charging = energy from solar panel to circuit without battery switched on
I'd have thought "Charging" would refer to battery, so this would be panel to battery with circuit off.

charging + consumption = " " + battery switched on
Solar panel providing current for BOTH circuit AND charging battery??

discharging + consumption = some lights from solar panel switched off + battery switched on
Panel not keeping up with circuit so drawing some current from battery

only discharging = battery + solar panel switched off
If battery and solar panel are both switched off, from where does ANY current come ?

As Berkeman suggests, a picture is worth a thousand words...
 
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I've attached a photo of the circuit to this message. Sorry, writing is in czech! :)
 

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spotrebic = appliance
stridac = inverters
 
Ok, from what I understand now from reading a bit more about off-grid systems.

Charging = PV array is not powering anything
Charging + consumption = PV array is powering appliance
Discharging + consumption = PV array isn't totally irradiated, is still powering appliance
Only discharging = PV array isn't powering anything.
 
Ahh i see .

I'm sorry if my post seemed impolite , it never dawned on me English might be a second language for you.

The picture and your additional posts helped a lot, thank you !

I often anthropomorphize things and talk them through as if i were a circuit element - "what do i see from its perspective ?"
Your regulator seems central so i'll pick his perspective.

Usually one figures 'efficiency' as Output/Input

and since there's no irradiance metering shown of the light striking the solar cell
i'd say solar panel power is always an input to your regulator

and since inverter doesn't have a meter on its output side,
i'd say power to the inverter is always an output from your regulatorand since power sometimes flows from regulator to battery and sometimes the other way
i'd say battery power is sometimes an output from your regulator and sometimes an input to it, and sometimes zero(neither input nor output).

And i'd calculate efficiency of the regulator for each case as ∑Output(s) / ∑Inputs(s)

If you do have an irradiance meter or know the input to your lamps you can put a number on the solar panel too.
 
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Thank you :)
output power = load, battery
input power = PV, battery
Now I just have to understand the distribution of power from the controller.
When discharging+consumption the battery and inverter (row 4, column 2 and 3) share an almost equal amount of power, and their signs are positive, while the PV has almost no power.
I assume this means the battery is outputting power to the controller, which in turn is distributing it to the inverter to power it, with small losses?
 

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