Finding critical points for phase planes

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Homework Help Overview

The discussion revolves around finding critical points for a system of differential equations defined by X' = x - y² and Y' = x² - xy - 2x. Participants are exploring the identification of critical points and the implications of their findings.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory, Assumption checking, Conceptual clarification

Approaches and Questions Raised

  • The original poster attempts to identify critical points and expresses confusion about the validity of certain points, such as (1,1) and (4,-2). Some participants question the original poster's reasoning regarding square roots and the interpretation of critical points.

Discussion Status

Participants are engaged in clarifying definitions and correcting misunderstandings about the nature of critical points. There is a recognition of the need to solve the equations simultaneously, and some guidance has been provided regarding substitution methods.

Contextual Notes

There is an emphasis on the definitions of critical points and the proper interpretation of mathematical expressions, particularly concerning square roots and their values. The original poster's approach has been challenged, leading to a deeper exploration of the problem.

NiallBucks
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Homework Statement


X'=x-y^2 Y'=x^2 -xy -2x

Homework Equations


Find the critical point of this system.

The Attempt at a Solution


I know one point is (0,0).
When I tried it I got sqrt(x)= 2 and sqrt(x)= 1 but the point (1,1) doesn't fit later parts of the question. I'm also aware that since a sqrt can have positive and negative values then (4, -2) can also equal zero. Am I missing something obvious?
 
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Frankly, I don't know what you mean by "When I tried it I got sqrt(x)= 2..." When you tried what? And why write "sqrt(x)= 2" rather than "x= 4"? In any case, a critical point of the system will be where x'= x- y^2= 0 and y'= x^2- xy- 2x= 0. From the first equation, x= y^2. Replacing x with y^2 in the second equation gives y^4- y^3- 2y^2= y^2(y^2- y- 1)= y^2(y+ 1)(y- 2)= 0.
 
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Sorry by 'try it' I meant solved for zero and I used sqrt(x) because I was trying to solve it in x instead of y. Your way makes much more sense and solved the problem! Thanks a million
 
NiallBucks said:

Homework Statement


X'=x-y^2 Y'=x^2 -xy -2x

Homework Equations


Find the critical point of this system.

The Attempt at a Solution


I know one point is (0,0).
When I tried it I got sqrt(x)= 2 and sqrt(x)= 1 but the point (1,1) doesn't fit later parts of the question. I'm also aware that since a sqrt can have positive and negative values then (4, -2) can also equal zero.
There are two things wrong with this sentence.
1) By definition, the square root of a nonnegative number represents a single value. For example, ##\sqrt{4} = + 2##. Period. You are mistaken to think that ##\sqrt{4} = \pm 2##.
2) "then (4, -2) can also equal zero." -- No. (4, -2) is a point in the plane. It cannot equal a single number such as zero.

BTW, (4, -2) is also NOT a solution of the equations below.
NiallBucks said:
Am I missing something obvious?
Set both X' and Y' to 0 and solve the resulting equations simultaneously.
IOW, solve
##x - y^2 = 0##
##x^2 - xy - 2x = 0##
It helps to use one of the equations to substitute in the other.
There are three solutions, one of which is (0, 0), which you already found. (1, 1) is NOT a solution, nor is (4, -2)..
 

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