Height of cliff using energy and speed of sound

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Homework Help Overview

The problem involves determining the height of a cliff from which a stone is dropped, with the additional context that the splash sound is heard 4.0 seconds later. The subject area includes concepts from kinematics and energy conservation.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory, Assumption checking, Mathematical reasoning

Approaches and Questions Raised

  • The original poster attempts to relate the time taken for the stone to fall and the time for the sound to travel back to the top of the cliff, using energy equations and kinematic formulas. Some participants suggest verifying the calculations by substituting the found height back into the equations to check for consistency.

Discussion Status

The discussion is ongoing, with participants exploring the calculations and questioning the accuracy of the results. There is a focus on identifying potential errors in the mathematical approach, particularly in the application of the quadratic formula and the resulting values.

Contextual Notes

Participants note that the original poster's submission was marked incorrect based on significant figures, and there is an emphasis on the need to ensure the calculations align with the total time of 4 seconds.

toothpaste666
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Homework Statement


[/B]
A stone is dropped from the top of a cliff. The splash it makes when striking the water below is heard 4.0s later.
how high is the cliff

Homework Equations


.5mv^2+mgy = E
v = v0 + at
v = d/t

The Attempt at a Solution



The question says after the rock is DROPPED so i need to figure out the time it took to drop and the time it took for the sound to travel back and those two times added together will be 4 sec
t1 is the time it takes for the rock to hit the water. using energy
mgh = .5mv^2
gh = .5v^2
to find v
v = v0 + at
v = gt
so
gh = .5g^2t^2
2h=gt^2
2h/g = t^2
t1= sqrt (2h/g)

to find t2
v = d/t
v=h/t
t2= h/v where v is speed of sound

t1 + t2 = 4
sqrt(2h/g) + h/v = 4
sqrt(2h/g) = 4 - h/v
2h/g = (4-h/v)^2
2h/g = 16 - 8h/v + h^2/v^2
2h/g +8h/v = 16 - h^2/v^2
2hv/gv + 8hg/gv = 16 - h^2/v^2
[(2hv+8hg)/gv] = 16 - h^2/v^2
[(2v+8g)/gv]h = 16 - h^2/v^2
h^2/v^2 + [(2v+8g)/gv]h - 16 = 0
(1/v^2)h^2 +[(2v+8g)/gv]h -16 = 0
(1/(343^2))h^2 + [(2*343+8*9.8)/(9.8*343)]h -16 = 0
(8.50x10^-6)h^2 + .227 h -16 = 0
using quadratic formula
[-.227 +/- sqrt((-.227^2)-4(8.50x10^-6)(-16))]/(2* (8.50x10^-6)
(-.227 +/- .228)/ (1.7*10^-5)

-.227 + .228/ (1.7*10^-5) = 58.8m = h

mastering physics wants it to 2 sig figs so i submitted 59 m but it was marked wrong. where did i make a mistake?
 
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Have you tried substituting your answer back into the starting equations to calculate the two times?
 
t1 = sqrt(2h/g) = sqrt((2*58.8)/9.8) = 3.46
t2 = h/v = 58.8/343 = .171
t1 + t2 = 4
3.46 + .171 = 3.63
so its not quite 4
 
toothpaste666 said:
t1 = sqrt(2h/g) = sqrt((2*58.8)/9.8) = 3.46
t2 = h/v = 58.8/343 = .171
t1 + t2 = 4
3.46 + .171 = 3.63
so its not quite 4
Well short of 4. So try subbing it in the last quadratic equation. Narrow down the location of the error that way.
 
ended up finding it by trial and error that way. still trying to figure out where i went wrong mathematically
 

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