Courses How do you deal with courses you just hate?

[JasonRox]

So, how do you do it?

I have this problem where I just don't want to do anything.

For example, I hate probability and statistics. I just can't find myself to put any work in it. I'd be happy with B-. I'm used to getting A's, but I hate that class so much I don't care whatsoever what my grade is. As long as I pass without affecting my average too much.

It's not that I can't do better. I can do better.

I'm getting more of a motivation to do my work now, but more so because I want a decent grade.

I enjoy courses like Analysis, Abstract Algebra, Linear Algebra (not application), Topology, and the like.

So, you guessed it. I hate applications. They bore me to the bones!

Anyways, have you had classes you just hated? How did you manage to do it? What was the motivation?

Note: I have plenty of lame courses to take this year. I freaking hate it. It feels like I'm spending thousands of dollars on garbage. I'm more than happy to take other mathematics courses. Why must I take freaking Statistics, Probability, Optimization, Computer Applications, and so on...?! I'm going to snap one day. I can't wait for graduate school, so that I can finish doing things I utterly hate.

 

[StatMechGuy]

Typically I tried to find something interesting in the boringness. I had to do something like that when I took advanced combinatorics: the class was entirely CS majors or Math majors, and here's the lone physics major, bored out of his mind of counting things. The key is to realize that these things are actually important.

For example: are you familiar with probabilistic methods of proof? It definitely involves a knowledge of probability, and it's pretty challenging and sufficiently abstract that you'd probably like it.

Also, I laugh at your belief that you no longer have to do things you hate in graduate school.

 

[JasonRox]

Also, I laugh at your belief that you no longer have to do things you hate in graduate school.

I knew I would get that comment.

But I doubt the bad things are as bad as having like 6-7 classes out of 9 that you HATE!

 

[Quaoar]

Here's my solution: If you really hate a class, just don't attend it (except for mid-terms, finals, homework turn-in, etc). I didn't do this terribly often, but sometimes I had a professor that was so bad I felt like I was getting stupider by attending the class. Personal study was enough for me in those instances.

 

[kdinser]

I get nothing out of watching a professor do example problems in class. This semester, I'm taking a class that is a combination of some microcontroller programming and static’s and dynamics. I found the first half of the class interesting, the microcontroller part, but now that we are into the static’s and dynamics part, I'm so bored I could cry. So I'm doing what the previous poster suggested, just not going. All he does is spend 10 mins on some theory that I can get out of any statics/dynamics textbook and spends the rest of the hour working example after example. I see absolutely no point at all in driving the 45 mins out to school and sitting through a 1 hour lecture 3 times a week watching the professor work problems that are nothing more then applications of things I learned in Calc III, linear algebra, and diff EQ. If I had another class mon, wed, and fri, it would be worth the drive, but not for this.

 

[moose]

Study with friends?

 

[JasonRox]

Study with friends?

I thought about that, but there aren't many students in the class. For those that I know, they do not care to do so anyways.

If I want a little math talk, I go to my professors. The next closest thing is helping students. That's about it. No one is interested in mathematics in the classroom period.

I'm all alone on this.

Another reason I'm excited for graduate school, I can't wait to make good friends with a fellow classmate and just chat up math.

 

[moose]

Another reason I'm excited for graduate school, I can't wait to make good friends with a fellow classmate and just chat up math.

Umm, try to remember back in high school why you were excited for undergrad. If it's at all similar, be careful?

I know that I can't wait for college for many reasons, hehe

 

[Ki Man]

If you know a hitman, you're problems could be... resolved quite efficiently ;] jk

I know bad teachers very well. My advice would be to block them out of your mind and find things to look forward to in your day. Optomism is a good helper

 

[oksanav]

Just remember that the semester isn't that long. We get so upset about courses, because for some reason we think we'll have to do that every day for"ever". It's a feeling that goes back to grade school. I guess we were serfs in a past life. (What are the statistics on that?) I try not to waste too much time hating them anymore, because inevitably the semester flies by and I do get something out of the course. I get nightmares about being in them again though. *shivers*

 

[JasonRox]

If you know a hitman, you're problems could be... resolved quite efficiently ;] jk

I know bad teachers very well. My advice would be to block them out of your mind and find things to look forward to in your day. Optomism is a good helper

It's not the professor that makes it so boring.

It's the material itself. I hate the material period. You can get very entertaining people to teach it, yet I won't be interested. I find things like Probability and Statistics really dull.

 

[courtrigrad]

why do you find it dull? After all, all of the pure stuff can't really be applied in the real world. Probability has many applications in many fields. So what really is the point of studying abstract, pure math when it won't really have any significant applications to the real world (other than self-satisfaction)?

 

[0rthodontist]

So why are you taking it? My attitude towards courses I don't like is, arrange it so I never take them in the first place, and withdraw from them if it turns out I don't like them by midsemester. Is statistics a degree requirement? (it isn't one here unless you do statistics concentration)

I didn't like my stats classes because my prof was terrible. He was physically very sick and could barely make it through a class. But stats is used in information theory, so it interests me. Why would you dislike a subject just because it has an application?

 

[mathwonk]

try to make friends with someone who loves the course. enthusiasm is contagious.

 

[GreenApple]

Probability and Statistics is required by my major, which is software engineering! I am taking that course right now and I don't like it at all, for the sake of the material itself, not the teacher.
I tried but could not like it. Though I love algebra and analysis.
I have here too many courses required which I don't like.
Know what I do with these? I attend classes , because I would never study the materials myself. I would bring to the class with the materials needed for the course and also bring materials of another course which I hate so that whenever the class made me want to die, I would just start to hit the book of the other boring course which would become a pleasure in some sense.

 

[leon1127]

i used to hate statistics
but then i tried to investigate the notion of inner product and variance then relate them into statistical mechanics
today i was learning how to use functional analysis in semiparametric estimations.
it is just depends on you.

 

[courtrigrad]

why doesn't anybody like probability and statistics?

 

[devious_]

Because they are boring as hell.

 

[Maxwell]

I hate to say it, but I basically slept through my Probability & Statistics lectures. For some reason, I could NOT stay awake for an hour and a half in that class. I've never done that before in a course, but just listening to an asian dude talk only to the blackboard was too much.

What I did was I bought extra textbooks. That way, when I was doing the HW or studying for an exam, I had plenty of references.

Hopefully this isn't a common occurance for you, taking classes you hate.

 

[JasonRox]

Hopefully this isn't a common occurance for you, taking classes you hate.

It't not really, but this year it is. I like the lectures of the one course, but I hate the material we are learning. The prof. is a good lecturer so I'm always there.

Yeah, probability and statistics just suck. I hesitate to even call it math.

 

[scorpa]

My entire semester this year is filled with classes I hate, and the sad thing is statistics is one of the high points of the day :( I just try to keep reminding myself the semester is almost over, then I am back to the good stuff again. It's just so hard to motivate myself to study all this useless crap...haha

 

[mattmns]

Probability is cool, statistics (I am guessing you mean statistical inference) is boring as hell. There are only a few more weeks in the semester, you will get through it

 

[Equilibrium]

OMG...
Software Engineering!

Is it true?

Btw
How come they are boring??

 

[americanforest]

I have it worse than most of you. I just switched for a major I absolutely despise, Computer Engineering, to Applied Physics, which I love dearly. The problem is that this leaves me with two or three Computer Engineering classes to finish this semester, which I neither want, nor need to take. The worst is Object Oriented Programming in Java. The other one I hate is Discrete Structure (Math for Computer Science). I like Math, but that class is awful. I just can't wait to get out of these horrid classes and cast off the stench of this horrible major once and for all and finally take things I really want to take.

 

[chingkui]

Pick up a measure-theoretical probability book from the library, maybe it helps.
When I was in school, I never let the class syllabus dictate what I learn. If I find a topic too boring, I would look for something related but way deeper and learn it myself. This way I learn something and keep my grade from free falling.

 

[JasonRox]

Pick up a measure-theoretical probability book from the library, maybe it helps.
When I was in school, I never let the class syllabus dictate what I learn. If I find a topic too boring, I would look for something related but way deeper and learn it myself. This way I learn something and keep my grade from free falling.

I wouldn't say my grades free fall. I read the textbook, but then the textbook isn't related to the class, and so I read the lecture notes as well.

Not sure how well I did on the first midterm though.

It makes me kind of nervous now because I never show up, so they handed back the midterms like over a month ago. They probably don't have it now!

Yeah, I'm bad for that. But I got 90% on the last assignment. I felt like I got an A on the last midterm, and the second midterm (last night) probably a B+ or higher.

I never showed up in a long time. Bad habit.

My attitude is starting to change though. I hope to start a blog and maybe have people learn from my experiences being a bum.

 

[Ki Man]

being a bum can't be that bad

you get to yell at people about the apocalypse with a valid excuse

 

[verty]

I once decided not to attend the lectures for a subject about operating systems. I went the first day, got the syllabus and didn't go again. There was no class-work and the lecturer was insipid.

It turned out that the lecturer altered the syllabus and when it came to the exam, the work I had learned made up only 40% of the paper.

He was wrong to change the syllabus, but anyhow I would have avoided any trouble if I had attended. I didn't take the matter further, on reflection perhaps I should have. Of course, the fact that no-one else fell for it makes one look a little stupid. Funny then that my fault was assuming the lecturer had as high standards as I would think one in that position should have.

So deciding not to attend can invite trouble.

 

[JasonRox]

So deciding not to attend can invite trouble.

That's the obvious though.

I do all my work, so it shouldn't make a difference whether it's 40% of the mark or 60%.

 

[oksanav]

Not going at all is ridiculous. I might only make it to half the class periods for some classes, at best, but at least I go enough to know what's going on...

 

[JasonRox]

Not going at all is ridiculous. I might only make it to half the class periods for some classes, at best, but at least I go enough to know what's going on...

I guess so.

Maybe I'll go next week for a little bit.

 

[ultimateguy]

I hate pretty much all of my classes this term, but not because of the content. I find my professors ruin everything. I really want to learn quantum mechanics but I feel like my professor is a roadblock to doing it.

 

[backdoorstudent]

So, how do you do it?

I have this problem where I just don't want to do anything.

Me too. Good thing you're not as bad as me - I hate doing everything. I could barely stomach making this post.

 

[JasonRox]

I also find that if I do not like a subject, it really affects my performance in class. A friend of mine used to say-"Just see it as fighting a tough opponent-either you win and do well or the opponent wins and you do poorly." I really wish I could think like this for the classes I do not like.

Yeah, I know.

It's getting better for me though, so we will see. Maybe I'll have some words of wisdom to share.

 

[turbo]

Jason, I had an accelerated calculus course in my freshman year of engineering school. The course was at 8:00 and the instructor was never even awake when he showed up. Worse, one of my classmates (J.H., a very sharp guy) used to catch him in mistakes almost daily and the instructor would look at the board and say "Oh yes, just a mistake in the algebra" and erase the problem without completing it properly, so people were just sitting there shaking their heads wondering HOW to attack the problem. When you pay for a college education, you should expect to get some education, not the crap that Hooper delivered every morning. When I confronted him, he said that I was not performing well and that he had decided to fail me, so I could not drop the class without penalty. I told him that I was going to haul his ass before the dean if he did not allow me to drop the class, and he did so. Some instructors are fabulous, and some are there to collect a paycheck. Patronize the former and shun the latter.

 

[JasonRox]

Jason, I had an accelerated calculus course in my freshman year of engineering school. The course was at 8:00 and the instructor was never even awake when he showed up. Worse, one of my classmates (J.H., a very sharp guy) used to catch him in mistakes almost daily and the instructor would look at the board and say "Oh yes, just a mistake in the algebra" and erase the problem without completing it properly, so people were just sitting there shaking their heads wondering HOW to attack the problem. When you pay for a college education, you should expect to get some education, not the crap that Hooper delivered every morning. When I confronted him, he said that I was not performing well and that he had decided to fail me, so I could not drop the class without penalty. I told him that I was going to haul his ass before the dean if he did not allow me to drop the class, and he did so. Some instructors are fabulous, and some are there to collect a paycheck. Patronize the former and shun the latter.

I'm glad you did what you did. Mistakes are fine, but if it's daily, that's just pathetic.

Like, I do problems in front of a class for my Linear Algebra class, but I always do them before. I know how to do the problems without any big difficulty, but this just avoids making errors, which can confuse students more. That's the last thing I want.

 

[turbo]

I'm glad you did what you did. Mistakes are fine, but if it's daily, that's just pathetic.

Like, I do problems in front of a class for my Linear Algebra class, but I always do them before. I know how to do the problems without any big difficulty, but this just avoids making errors, which can confuse students more. That's the last thing I want.

That's admirable, and it's important to emphasize WHY you are doing particular operations in a certain way. There's a lot of stuff that you have internalized and said to yourself "that's the way you do this" that at least some of your students will not recognize or that they haven't formalized to the point where they can appreciate what you are doing at the board. Go back to the fundamentals frequently - Feynman was a great lecturer, but one of his strengths was that he would readily say "we do this and it works, but nobody knows why" or something similar. He was pragmatic, and if someone asked him what was the source of inertia, instead of spouting some crap, he would immediately have said "nobody knows".

 

[JasonRox]

That's admirable, and it's important to emphasize WHY you are doing particular operations in a certain way. There's a lot of stuff that you have internalized and said to yourself "that's the way you do this" that at least some of your students will not recognize or that they haven't formalized to the point where they can appreciate what you are doing at the board. Go back to the fundamentals frequently - Feynman was a great lecturer, but one of his strengths was that he would readily say "we do this and it works, but nobody knows why" or something similar. He was pragmatic, and if someone asked him what was the source of inertia, instead of spouting some crap, he would immediately have said "nobody knows".

Sounds like what I do!

It's just the way it is.

 

[Ki Man]

for the subjects you find really uninteresting, try to find something within that topic that really interests you

 

[oksanav]

My calc II teacher was atrocious. Near the beginning of the semester I asked him to work a problem on integrating something like csc^2xcosx. He looked at me and said in a cocky voice," well, what did you have a problem with it seems pretty obvious to me." He then proceeded to work the problem out, incorrectly, until he finally realized it wasn't an easy memorized one. And then he ran out of time to do it the right way. I was so confused, because I tried to follow him when he did it the wrong way, even though it didn't seem right. I quickly saw the futility of going to this guys class.

 

[mattmns]

My calc II teacher was atrocious. Near the beginning of the semester I asked him to work a problem on integrating something like csc^2xcosx. He looked at me and said in a cocky voice," well, what did you have a problem with it seems pretty obvious to me." He then proceeded to work the problem out, incorrectly, until he finally realized it wasn't an easy memorized one. And then he ran out of time to do it the right way. I was so confused, because I tried to follow him when he did it the wrong way, even though it didn't seem right. I quickly saw the futility of going to this guys class.

If I were in that class, and asked that question, when he made the mistake, I would have said, "pretty obvious, huh?" in a cocky sarcastic voice.

 

[Ki Man]

theres a business teacher at my school that said she would never single a student out, and right after saying that she singled out a kid for something they did before class

its a wonder that some of these people are actually paid to sit around all day when they don't know how to teach

 

[matt grime]

Yeah, probability and statistics just suck. I hesitate to even call it math.

Then you are judgemental and wrong, not to mention leaping to conclusions based upon your uninformed position of what maths is, and what these subjects are. You're actually saying "this does not fit with my preconcieved ideas of what maths ought to be". Only the young tend to be so black and white about things they know little about.

Of course, since you're just using the title of the course which *conveys no idea of what the actual content of the course is*, we are all in the dark about what it is you loathe.

If you dislike genuine probability then you should be careful about ever taking any advanced analysis courses since measure and probability are essentially the same subject - borel sigma algebras, fubini's theorem, dominated convergence, lebesgue integrals - probability is measure theory in spaces of finite total measure.

Anyone who's done markov chains, queuing theory, some nice stuff like that would never say it was not real maths. Not to mention probabilistic graph theory, one of Erdos's contribution to maths. Then there's the necessity of things like probabilty in modelling dynamical systems, quantum mechanics...

I wish people would distinguish between the two topics, probability and statistics, since they are vastly different subjects and should not be lumped together like this.

 

[JasonRox]

Then you are judgemental and wrong, not to mention leaping to conclusions based upon your uninformed position of what maths is, and what these subjects are. You're actually saying "this does not fit with my preconcieved ideas of what maths ought to be". Only the young tend to be so black and white about things they know little about.

Of course, since you're just using the title of the course which *conveys no idea of what the actual content of the course is*, we are all in the dark about what it is you loathe.

If you dislike genuine probability then you should be careful about ever taking any advanced analysis courses since measure and probability are essentially the same subject - borel sigma algebras, fubini's theorem, dominated convergence, lebesgue integrals - probability is measure theory in spaces of finite total measure.

Anyone who's done markov chains, queuing theory, some nice stuff like that would never say it was not real maths. Not to mention probabilistic graph theory, one of Erdos's contribution to maths. Then there's the necessity of things like probabilty in modelling dynamical systems, quantum mechanics...

I wish people would distinguish between the two topics, probability and statistics, since they are vastly different subjects and should not be lumped together like this.

Haha, I didn't mean it like that. Just as a joke.

I'm dealing with it. I find solving general things tolerable, in fact it doesn't bother me whatsoever. I'm sure neat problems are to come.

The things that bother me are the tedious things like... if you get 1$ here, and so on. I hate doing that stuff. It seems like these problems are just merely knowing which formula to use. Honestly, I don't always know which one to use and maybe that's why I hate it. I have no idea. We will see.

 

[JasonRox]

Pick up a measure-theoretical probability book from the library, maybe it helps.

Would this teach me all the probability tools I need?

That's my main concern for now.

 

[Cyrus]

Hey Jason, Prob and Stat does suck, until you see it in action.

At work, it is used HEAVILY for Kalmaan filtering processes where you have statistical uncertainties in position and attitude estimates from sensors and you use statistical analysis to filter out these errors. Its very very powerful stuff and not to be underestimated.

If you don't think so, there would be no such thing as GPS without it.

 

[JasonRox]

If you don't think so, there would be no such thing as GPS without it.

I can't say what I think since I never saw it yet.