How Does Homogeneity of Space and Time Affect Lagrangian Mechanics?

AI Thread Summary
Homogeneity of space and time dictates that the Lagrangian should not explicitly depend on position or time, leading to the conclusion that it can only be a function of velocity. However, the general definition of the Lagrangian includes position and time, which creates confusion regarding its application in different scenarios. In a uniform gravitational field, the Lagrangian does depend on position due to potential energy, while for a free particle, it is solely a function of speed. The relationship between the general form L(q, q̇, t) and the specific case L(v²) illustrates that the latter is a restricted case where position and time dependencies are eliminated. This distinction clarifies that L(v²) is not in contrast with the general definition but rather a specific instance of it.
Andrea Vironda
Messages
69
Reaction score
3
Hi,
i know that The homogeneity of space and time implies that the Lagrangian cannot contain
explicitly either the radius vector r of the particle or the time t, i.e. L must be a function of v only

but the lagrangian definition is ##L=\int L(\dot q,q,t)##, so velocity appears in the definition and it's in contrast with ##L=L(v^2)##
why?
 
Physics news on Phys.org
The definition is general, and not just for homogeneous space and time. For example, in a uniform gravitational field, the Lagrangian of a particle does depend on position, through the potential energy (mgy). The Lagrangian of a free particle does not depend on position. It also does not depend on direction (isotropy) and depends only on the square of the speed.
 
Why should ##L(q,\dot{q},t)## and ##L(v^2)## be in contrast at all? The latter sais, that ##L## in that specific case depends on ##v=\dot{q}## only via ##v^2## and that the dependence on ##q## and ##t## drops, so ##L(v^2)## is a specific restriction of the most general case ##L(q,\dot{q},t)##, but not in contrast with it.
 
  • Like
Likes vanhees71
The rope is tied into the person (the load of 200 pounds) and the rope goes up from the person to a fixed pulley and back down to his hands. He hauls the rope to suspend himself in the air. What is the mechanical advantage of the system? The person will indeed only have to lift half of his body weight (roughly 100 pounds) because he now lessened the load by that same amount. This APPEARS to be a 2:1 because he can hold himself with half the force, but my question is: is that mechanical...
Some physics textbook writer told me that Newton's first law applies only on bodies that feel no interactions at all. He said that if a body is on rest or moves in constant velocity, there is no external force acting on it. But I have heard another form of the law that says the net force acting on a body must be zero. This means there is interactions involved after all. So which one is correct?
Thread 'Beam on an inclined plane'
Hello! I have a question regarding a beam on an inclined plane. I was considering a beam resting on two supports attached to an inclined plane. I was almost sure that the lower support must be more loaded. My imagination about this problem is shown in the picture below. Here is how I wrote the condition of equilibrium forces: $$ \begin{cases} F_{g\parallel}=F_{t1}+F_{t2}, \\ F_{g\perp}=F_{r1}+F_{r2} \end{cases}. $$ On the other hand...
Back
Top